wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member Topic Starter
2 months ago

Don’t be gaslighted by football memories that only go back 20 years.

Yes, the Tush Push is most likely on its way out, in its current form. Yes, the Green Bay Packers  are the team that submitted the rules proposal to do away with it. And yes, twice during the 2024 season the Packers played the Philadelphia Eagles  — the team that most famously and successfully uses the play — and the Packers lost both games.


But no, the rules proposal is not doing away with some long-standing NFL rule or erasing a fundamental facet of the sport of football.


Somehow, a narrative has arisen among some NFL fans and analysts that this play — pushing a quarterback from behind on a QB sneak — is symbolic and indicative of “old-school football” and that banning pushing ball-carriers from behind is tantamount to eliminating a core facet of the game that dates back to its early days. However, this argument could not be farther from the truth.


In fact, this rule change closes a loophole that was created just 20 years ago, returning football to how it was played prior to 2005. The rule penalizing “assisting a runner” has existed since the early days of the sport of football. Research on exactly when the rule was instituted is challenging, but it may date back as far as 1906. The Intercollegiate Athletic Association (which would later become the NCAA) instituted a massive set of rules changes for football that year, partially at the behest of then-president Theodore Roosevelt, in response to a slew of deaths during violent college football games.


Among the rules implemented that year  were legalizing the forward pass, requiring a neutral zone betweenv the offensive and defensive lines, and requiring 10 yards for a first down. All of those rules were implemented to make the game safer and more spread out, avoiding the massive scrums and impacts that led to those fatalities. Although this writer could not find clear confirmation that the assisting the runner penalty was included that year, it is logical that it would be included as a safety-related change.


At the very least, we know that pushing a runner from behind was illegal during Vince Lombardi’s tenure as head coach of the Packers, and that it had been illegal for some time before that. Perhaps the best example of this is shown in a famous photo of Bart Starr’s quarterback sneak during the Ice Bowl in December 1967.


Chuck Mercein, the running back behind Starr on the play, thought he was getting the football on the play when Starr elected to sneak it. Here is a quote from Mercein, who talked to Packers team historian Cliff Christl for an article published in 2017 :

I’m almost in the hole when I realize I’m not going to get the ball, (Starr’s) keeping it. So the next thing I thought, ‘Pull up. Don’t push him into the end zone or assist him, which was a penalty.’ I couldn’t stop. When you’re on ice, you’re not going to stop on a dime. So that was when I threw my hands up in the air to kind of indicate to the officials, if they thought I was trying to push him in, that I didn’t have anything to do with it.



As Mercein’s comments suggest, the penalty for pushing a ball-carrier was so ingrained in football by the 1960s that a running back’s first thought — well, his second, after his surprise at not getting the handoff — was to find a way to make it clear to the referees that he wasn’t pushing his quarterback.


The rule continued on unchanged until 2005, when the NFL rolled back the “no pushing” rule, citing the difficulty of officiating the play. Still, there was little concern about rolling that change back to its original until recently.


Yes, the Eagles have found this loophole and capitalized on it. And is the impetus for the proposal to reinstate the ban on pushing a ball-carrier the Eagles’ relative advantage with this play? Possibly. Probably, even. If fans or pundits want to call the Packers or the rest of the NFL cowardly for doing away with pushing the ball-carrier, then that is their right.


But there are two final points worth acknowledging about the push to change the rule back. First, the NFL has often moved quickly to close loopholes in its rules that individual teams have used to create a competitive advantage. Personally, I think of this facet of the rule change as being similar to when the NFL changed rules around fumbles so that the offense could not advance a fumble on 4th down or in the last two minutes of the game. That rule change came about because of the “Holy Roller ” play in 1978, when Ken Stabler fumbled the football forward while being sacked. The league has often changed its rules quickly when loopholes are discovered, and if anything, it’s a bit surprising that they have not done so sooner with pushing a ball-carrier.


Finally, football fans should simply refuse to listen to those who are trying to push a revisionist history by claiming that this is doing away with something that is a foundational facet of the sport. It’s a dishonest argument when, in fact, pushing a runner was illegal for nearly a century and appears to be one of the rules created that largely define the sport as we know it today.

Continue Reading @ Evan "Tex" Western 

Evan "Tex" Western wrote:



A pretty decent article on pushing the or runner.
When the Eagles first started doing the tush push I didn't realize the rules had changed . I thought it was illegal. I thought about Chuck Mercei's comments. I am glad the were included in this story.
UserPostedImage
bboystyle
2 months ago
I hate the fact that we were the team to lead the charge in trying to ban it. Makes us seem like sore losers.
wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member Topic Starter
2 months ago

I hate the fact that we were the team to lead the charge in trying to ban it. Makes us seem like sore losers.

Originally Posted by: bboystyle 


It's not as if they are alone in feeling it needs to be dealt with. 21 other teams agreed with the Packers.
UserPostedImage
beast
2 months ago
The Packers people supposedly don't really care one way or the other ...

It's the NFL that twisted arms to get the Packers and Lions to push rules for them. I assume maybe because they owned the NFL one for giving them the drafts? Or maybe the NFL felt like they were the best ones to make a complaint for some reason.

I think the Eagles organization realizes this or more would of be made about it, and if it wasn't the Packers, then the NFL would of gotten someone else to do it

They really need to open it up, so the NFL can propose rules on their own and not use a team as a fake front, or let them say this was anonymously submitted, or submitted to us by a team, and it doesn't matter which one.
UserPostedImage
Fan Shout
dfosterf (4h) : It's my one day deal complaint dept. on shareholder meeting day
dfosterf (5h) : Probably a homer access credential intimidation kinda thing
dfosterf (5h) : Meathead "journalists" skip this, concentrating on operational revenue when convenient. They switch when net revenue is more favorable.
dfosterf (5h) : Resulting in an actual drop of net revenue of 12.5%. She is from Minnesota. Just sayin'
dfosterf (5h) : Any plans to hold Maureen Smith (CFO) accountable for a 95% drop in investment revenue?
Mucky Tundra (5h) : In your face, HBO!
Mucky Tundra (5h) : @ByRyanWood Mark Murphy: “A great source of pride of mine is that we were never on Hard Knocks.”
Mucky Tundra (5h) : *years
Mucky Tundra (6h) : @mattschneidman Mark Murphy says he anticipates “many Packers games” being played in Germany, Ireland and/or the U.K. over the next 5-10 yea
dfosterf (6h) : *cafeteria* I have hit my head also, so I sympathize
dfosterf (6h) : Possibly hit his head leaning into the glass protecting the food in the cafateria
dfosterf (6h) : Maybe a low flying drone
dfosterf (6h) : Did Savion Williams run into a goalpost or something?
Mucky Tundra (6h) : also, no bueno when a guy starts getting concussions right off the bat in his career
Zero2Cool (6h) : Concussion is worse. Banks probably vet off day via back booboo claim
Mucky Tundra (9h) : @AndyHermanNFL Jordy Nelson out at camp today. No word if he’s in play for one of the two open roster spots ; )
dfosterf (9h) : Is that better or worse than Banks bad back?
Zero2Cool (10h) : Savion concussion ... not good.
packerfanoutwest (24-Jul) : Aaron Rodgers’s first pass of first team period was picked off
Mucky Tundra (24-Jul) : tbh I didn't hear of his passing
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Cosby Show. Malcom Jamal Warner I think is real name
Mucky Tundra (24-Jul) : I was thinking of Ozzy and Hulk
Mucky Tundra (24-Jul) : Who's Theo?
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : How is Theo alliteration?
Mucky Tundra (24-Jul) : Bad week for people whose names are alliterations
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Hulk Hogan gone too.
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Oh, it's toe injury
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Hope it's not serious. that would stink
dfosterf (24-Jul) : Sounds like an ankle not a knee for Fields
dfosterf (24-Jul) : Ya Flaccp on Browns
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Maybe Tyrod Taylor instead
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : He's on Browns, right?
dfosterf (24-Jul) : They would probably go with Flacco is my guess if Fields out
dfosterf (24-Jul) : Fleece 'em again!
Zero2Cool (24-Jul) : Malik Willis might be someone Jets come after
packerfanoutwest (24-Jul) : Packers introduce 1923-inspired classic uniform, leather-look helmet
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : Both LB Quay Walker and Rookie DB Micah Robinson have passed their physicals
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : Happy to see site feels more snappy snappy
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : No sir. I did not.
dfosterf (23-Jul) : You didn't get free childcare when you were at work?
wpr (23-Jul) : These guys make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. Pay for their own childcare.
dfosterf (23-Jul) : 2nd issue. Number 1 issue was no gameday childcare. 1 of 3 teams not providing it
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : Suppose if locker room is main issue, we sitting pretty
wpr (23-Jul) : I thought so Mucky. In those useless player polls GB always rates high overall. Locker is a part of it.
Mucky Tundra (23-Jul) : Wasn't the locker room just updated like 6 or 7 years ago?
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : I have forum updated on different site. We'll see how this one goes before going to that
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : Elgton Jenkins has a back injury, is expect to end contract dispute
wpr (23-Jul) : It's funny the PA complained about the locker room. It wasn't that long ago it was top shelf. Things change in a hurry.
wpr (23-Jul) : The site is much more better.
Zero2Cool (23-Jul) : NFLPA report said Packers lockerroom needed upgrade. Whining bout where you change?
Please sign in to use Fan Shout
2025 Packers Schedule
Sunday, Sep 7 @ 3:25 PM
LIONS
Thursday, Sep 11 @ 7:15 PM
COMMANDERS
Sunday, Sep 21 @ 12:00 PM
Browns
Sunday, Sep 28 @ 7:20 PM
Cowboys
Sunday, Oct 12 @ 3:25 PM
BENGALS
Sunday, Oct 19 @ 3:25 PM
Cardinals
Sunday, Oct 26 @ 7:20 PM
Steelers
Sunday, Nov 2 @ 12:00 PM
PANTHERS
Monday, Nov 10 @ 7:15 PM
EAGLES
Sunday, Nov 16 @ 12:00 PM
Giants
Sunday, Nov 23 @ 12:00 PM
VIKINGS
Thursday, Nov 27 @ 12:00 PM
Lions
Sunday, Dec 7 @ 12:00 PM
BEARS
Sunday, Dec 14 @ 3:25 PM
Broncos
Friday, Dec 19 @ 11:00 PM
Bears
Friday, Dec 26 @ 11:00 PM
RAVENS
Saturday, Jan 3 @ 11:00 PM
Vikings
Recent Topics
5h / Around The NFL / Mucky Tundra

6h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

12h / Green Bay Packers Talk / TheKanataThrilla

15h / Green Bay Packers Talk / dfosterf

21h / Around The NFL / beast

24-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Martha Careful

24-Jul / Around The NFL / beast

24-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

23-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

23-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

22-Jul / Random Babble / Zero2Cool

22-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

22-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

20-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

20-Jul / Green Bay Packers Talk / Mucky Tundra

Headlines
Copyright © 2006 - 2025 PackersHome.com™. All Rights Reserved.