Jordan Morgan pick is already haunting the Packers in 2024

beast
Select Member Topic Starter

3 months ago

Just to be clear, I don't agree with the article, I just thought it might make an interesting pot stirring comment to get more people talking.

My take is they're basically complaining the player isn't playing the position that want, but to the articles own point, it doesn't seem like the team drafted him to play there.

And they didn't offer any alterations draft picks. Like if you're demanding an OT, they could of suggested Tyler Guyton whom the Cowboys took at #29. I wasn't surprised they a potential OG, but I was thinking it would be OT/OG/C Graham Barton whom the Buccaneers took at #26, one pick behind Morgan at #25.

Though at the same time, they might have a point with OT being scary thin depth wise, as 2nd year UDFA Kadeem Telfort starting at RT with the current injuries.

Here is the link

The Green Bay Packers value versatility in their players, which is extremely helpful in a variety of cases, especially for offensive linemen. The more you can do, the better chance you have of playing for Matt LaFleur and Adam Stenavich. And to the Packers' credit, valuing versatility has paid off in tremendous ways already.

Elgton Jenkins and Zach Tom are a couple of primary examples of how valuing versatility has helped the Packers assemble their offensive line up to this point. But has prioritizing versatility burned the Packers with their selection of offensive lineman Jordan Morgan in the first round of the 2024 NFL Draft?

The early returns at training camp indicate that may be the case.

Jordan Morgan being shoehorned at guard is costing the Packers at tackle
The word out of Packers OTAs and minicamp was not overwhelmingly positive regarding the team's first-round pick out of Arizona. Matt LaFleur even stated publicly that Morgan had a long way to go when it came to the mental aspect of coming into an NFL program.

It seems as though he's been practicing better here as we've gotten into training camp, but the Packers are letting Morgan settle in at the right guard position, which is frustrating for a couple reasons.

Obviously, it would be great to have him settle into a spot and be able to be part of the starting five as a rookie, but this is a player who was a left tackle at Arizona. He's not only being kicked inside to guard but the Packers are having him play on the right side of the line. Again, that's not going to be a big deal if and when Morgan starts and excels at it, but the team lacks tackle depth and might have better alternative options on the interior offensive line.

With Zach Tom missing time, it seems like this would be the perfect opportunity for the Packers to get Morgan some work at the right tackle position, but as much as they may value that versatility from him, it's looking more and more like tackle was never really the plan for Morgan at all. The Packers are diving headfirst into him playing right guard, even at the expense of the tackle position.

Andre Dillard has been a sieve at training camp thus far, giving up pressure after pressure. Maybe things would be different if we were in the regular season, but the Packers' depth at tackle is certainly being tested, and if getting the best five out there is the top priority, you'd have to think Morgan would slide to right tackle at some point...right?

The sooner Tom is back in the mix, the better. After the investment the Packers just made in Jordan Love, seeing the offensive line struggle in training camp -- especially in the depth department -- is the last thing this team needs.

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Zero2Cool
Elite Member

3 months ago

I see it as Packers drafted an OL with the hopes he'd start. Of its LT or RG, I don't think it matters.

Pretty sure Packers draft OL with musical chairs in mind anyway lol

beast
Select Member Topic Starter

3 months ago

I see it as Packers drafted an OL with the hopes he'd start. Of its LT or RG, I don't think it matters.

Pretty sure Packers draft OL with musical chairs in mind anyway lol

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool

Yeah, the coaches say they want the best 5 on the field, and assuming they're all healthy, I think the open spot is RG.

Though if a single one gets injured, then I'm nervous, because our depth seems questionable at best.

Martha Careful
Member

3 months ago

I agree with the author.

I also fundamentally disagree with the notion of playing "the best 5". Would a basketball team start the best 5? Yes, I know it is a different game, but the comparison is illustrative.

I think "best five" mantra is poppycock.

The optimal physical skills and abilities of a LT are far different than center (or rg).

Versatility is fine, but generally, "Jack-of-all-trades" are "masters of none."

Versatility and flexibility can be the enemies of excellence.

Go Packers!!!!

beast
Select Member Topic Starter

3 months ago

I also fundamentally disagree with the notion of playing "the best 5". Would a basketball team start the best 5? Yes, I know it is a different game, but the comparison is illustrative.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful

That's very different, and not because it's a different sport, but because it's different positions.

The NBA does ask big men to play small roles, or small men to play big roles, just like the NFL doesn't ask the OL and WR to switch positions.

But the NFL does ask the OL to switch among themselves. And the NBA ask point guards and shooting guards to switch positions, likewise they can ask the small forward and the power forward to switch positions.

So yes, but sports have similar positions rotate or switch roles when it's best for the team.

Versatility is fine, but generally, "Jack-of-all-trades" are "masters of none."

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful

Okay but whom is saying Morgan is a jack of all trades? Morgan was an elite pass blocker at LT in college. Just people feared that he didn't have the length to say at OT in the pros.

But even at OG, his strength will be his pass blocking, just like Myers strength is pass blocking.

Also,

The original version of the phrase "jack of all trades" was used in the 17th century to praise people with many talents. It was often used to describe William Shakespeare, who would help with the stage, sets, and costumes for plays, as well as remember lines and try directing. The full phrase is "a jack of all trades is a master of none, but oftentimes better than a master of one". The idea is that someone who is interested in many different fields and skills will be better off than someone who is hyper-focused on one field.

The phrase "master of none" was added later, after the industrial revolution.

So the original phrase of that suggested jack of all trades were better.

Versatility and flexibility can be the enemies of excellence.

To be excellent, one must be versatile and flexible, or they will never be excellent.

Take Bakhtiari, great pass blocker, and people love to trash his run blocking, but he actually improved it to be average. Average ain't great, but it was no longer a weakness.

Like the Packers need LT Walker to improve his run blocking, right now, he's just a pass blocker only. Then again, other than Tom, you can probably say that about the Packers entire starting OL. They need to improve their run blocking.

Martha Careful
Member

3 months ago

Beast,

I greatly enjoy your posts...even when we disagree (which means if I agreed with you, we would both be wrong 😊)

That's very different, and not because it's a different sport, but because it's different positions.

Originally Posted by: beast

This is my point....THEY ARE different positions, albeit to a lesser extent than basketball or baseball

Okay but whom is saying Morgan is a jack of all trades?

Originally Posted by: beast

I am not saying he is good at anything at this point. I had hoped he would be a very good LT, but his early would would not seem to indicate he is being close to ready. That does not mean he will be any good at RT..

So the original phrase of that suggested jack of all trades were better.

Originally Posted by: beast

Perhaps, but for the last 100 years, the more common use of the phrase is "jack of all trades, master of none." I will ask for the older folks 60+ to opine on this. assertion.

To be excellent, one must be versatile and flexible, or they will never be excellent.

Originally Posted by: beast

This is not a bad quote, but I have never heard it, and don't necessary agree with it.

...the Packers need LT Walker to improve his run blocking, right now, he's just a pass blocker only. Then again, other than Tom, you can probably say that about the Packers entire starting OL. They need to improve their run blocking.

Originally Posted by: beast

AN OUTSTANDING POINT AND OBSERVATION. On this we agree.

Go Packers!!!!

beast
Select Member Topic Starter

3 months ago

This is my point....THEY ARE different positions, albeit to a lesser extent than basketball or baseball

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful

Yes they are different positions, but they do similar things, pass block and run block. And they do switch positions among similar positions just like basketball and baseball.

And Morgan has never been an NFL OT, he's only been a college OT. And a lot of college OTs get kicked inside in the NFL, especially when they have OG size.

If Morgan were to start at OT, he'd have the 3rd shortest arms behind #1 Rams Alaric Jackson, #2 Colts Bernhard Raimann.

And as you said, he's got some learning to do, which some OTs have started off playing OG for a season or two before getting their shot at OT.

This is not a bad quote, but I have never heard it, and don't necessary agree with it.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful

It wasn't a quote, it was Beast's opinion.

AN OUTSTANDING POINT AND OBSERVATION. On this we agree.

Originally Posted by: Martha Careful

Packers prioritize pass blocking and in a passing league that makes sense.

Also as a draft nerd, I can tell you that good pass blocking in college translate a lot better to being good in the pros, than good run blocking in college. There have been a number of great college run blockers, taken early in the draft and straight up busted. There have been a few pass blockers too, but normally you can spot them out as they have NO POWER in their game, they're clearly soft and power rushers will eat them alive.

earthquake
Member

3 months ago

If we're looking at:

Walker - Jenkins - Meyers - Morgan - Tom

vs

Morgan - Jenkins - Meyers - Newman - Tom

or

Walker - Jenkins - Meyers - Newman - Tom

I think it's hard to argue that the first option isn't both the best 5 and also the best line. Unless Morgan is just a bum or something it's hard to imagine Newman being on the field and either Morgan or Walker sitting on the bench as a good outcome.

But maybe - Morgan - Jenkins - Meyers - Rhyan - Tom - would be pretty good? Maybe even put Morgan at RT and Tom at LT?

blank

beast
Select Member Topic Starter

3 months ago

Originally Posted by: earthquake

Sounds like Morgan might have clearly passed Rhyan, and Rhyan clearly passed Newman based on whom gets snaps when they have guys missing time.

So I think when healthy, it's

Walker, Jenkins, Myers, Morgan, Tom

And a battle for the backup spots. I wonder if Morgan might be the top OT backup, or if they would keep him at OG.

As for Tom at LT, it seems like recently a lot of teams are putting their best pass rusher against the RT... so I'm fine with the Packers best OL staying at RT.

wpr
Preferred Member

3 months ago

#10

I guess there are a few questions that would need to be answered. Many of them have been addressed by our members but not by the Lombardie Ave ranter.

1. Did Walker do a decent job last season?

2. Did he improve as the year progressed?
If yes to both (my votes) then why the rush to shove him on the bench? If he isn't a liability then what is the rush to replace him? Very few rookies excel when they move from college to the pros.

3. Along that line, does writer think Morgan is clearly better than Walker? Over a 10-12 year career he probably is. In his first season probably not. At least not for the first half of the season. Why would the Packers want to weaken a critical position by throwing someone into the fire when it is not necessary? One of the strengths of this organization is not rushing rookies onto the field in big roles. Jordan would have been horrible as a starter his rookie year. Even in his 4th year he struggle for the first part of the season.

4. Is Morgan a better player than anyone the Packers would stick out there at RG? I think so. Why weaken the line in two positions simply because of where the Packers selected the player? No one is demanding that Monk start. Mainly because he was taken in the 5th round. Just because Morgan was taken the 1st round doesn't mandate that he play LT when they have someone doing a good job there AND they need someone to fill a hole at RG.

5. Going back to Beast's first comments. was Morgan the best lineman available when the Packers were on the clock? Gute thought so. Had the Packers taken an OG in the first someone would have complained that teams should never draft a G in the first round.

6. Also mentioned by Mr Beast, people who are complaining about Morgan playing RG are also some of the same people who said his arms are too short to play T. I liked how Bak laughed at that comment and reminded everyone that they said that about him too.

7. Sticking Morgan at RT simply to warm the seat while we waited for Toms to heal is probably the worst of all suggests. If he isn't going to play there it delays his learning the position he is actually going to play at. He needs reps. He needs a lot of reps. Why waste them somewhere he almost certainly isn't going to ever play? (No injuries allowed.)

8. Lastly, doesn't Gute and Co know a little more about what they are doing than the average fan or media personality? Pretty sure they do. Martha I don't deny your right to ask "why". The tone of the article comes off a little pompous to me. That is who I find fault with.

There was a hole on the line. The Packers filled it with a quality player. Walker basically has one year to improve his game or Morgan will shift over and take his place next year. The Packers will look at drafting a new RG or perhaps one of the backup guards will take a step forward but that is next year. Playing at the relatively sheltered position of RG gives Morgan a year to learn his craft in the NFL before going to a much more critical job of defending Jordan's blind side.

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