Barfarn
10 years ago
Greetings one and all, big and tall, short and small: [sorry to be so long winded...LOL]

First, Barrington did not run a 4.91 at the combine; he ran a 4.75 AND a 4.91. As alluded to by Bigby, Jerry Rice ran a 4.7 [4.692]. If limiting our discussion to combine times and assuming the 40 is the measure of athleticism; any ILB that is only .05 to .21 slower than Rice is “ATHLETIC” in my book!

Second, the time a guy runs at one point in time is not an ipso facto unrebuttable determination of a person’s speed; Barrington has run several 40s in the 4.6 range [Note: Rice ran several low 4.4’s] and SB ran a 4.69 at his pro day.

Third, there’ a billion reasons way a guy’s time might be slow at any one timing: he rocked back on start; wasn’t accustomed to a track start; was on unfamiliar/uncomfortable surface; human error; injury; etc. At the combine Barrington’s back stiffened; and yes in a week the back could feel better. Perhaps his back was only partly feeling better after a week and that’s why he ran as slow as 4.69 instead of a 4.59.

Fourth, Let’s discuss the pro day “home cooking.” Indy is 710 Ft above sea level; Bulls’ practice field is 48’ above sea level; making Indy’s altitude more favorable to running fast. Moreover, the pro day’s temp in the low 60’s w/ humidity is less favorable than running in dome w/ temps in high 60’s/low 70’s w/ humidity controlled.

No scout would attend a pro day knowing, for example, the players' agents would be manning and reading stop watches and/or using an 11” ruler to lay out each foot of the courses. EVERY Scout mans a watch and most of the time all the scouts share their results amongst themselves to establish a consensus. They will also either lay out the courses or verify their accuracy with their own measurements. The only “home cooking” involved in pro days is that the player gets to sleep in his own bed and is running on a surface he’s familiar with. Now Barrington did run his pro day 40s from N to S w/ a wind out of the NW between 3.7 and 5.7 meters/sec. It was not a direct tail wind; but it be would considered “wind aided” none the less. Tracks records are invalidated only if wind aided by more than 2 Meters/sec. Given that the tail wind was not direct and not that great, that track starts were done when wind died down and accounting for subsequent temp and altitude adjustments; Barrington’s pro day 40s, especially the critical 1.6 10 yard split, legitimately represents Barrington’s foot speed on that day for whatever that is worth.

Fifth, as GreenGold says, who cares how fast he is in a track event. 40 times are only looked at to evaluate how a player’s game might transfer to the NFL. Once he’s playing, you look at his play. So if he’s not athletic enough it should be demonstrated with plays like: Vareen splitting wide left and Barrington running out to cover him MAN. After the snap Brady ONLY looks left for 1.5-2 seconds until realizing Barrington is blanketing Vareen...he throws the ball elsewhere. Oops, bad example that Barrington lack athleticism.

Sixth, the thing about Green and gold glasses, when you look through them backwards, they work like binoculars...things tend to get real real small.
uffda udfa
10 years ago
No... Sam Barrington ran 4.91 at the combine and that is... TERRIBLE. Tangent left, tangent right. Doesn't change a thing.
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Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


uffda udfa
10 years ago

No... Sam Barrington ran 4.91 at the combine and that is... TERRIBLE. Tangent left, tangent right. Doesn't change a thing.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa 



4.91 is his OFFICIAL 40 time...the one the NFL goes with. I don't see a single soul commenting on how brutal that is...it's as bad as it gets for a LB. Horrid. Nothing but deflections and misdirections and validations for something that is nothing but abysmal.


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Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


10 years ago
I like Barrington a lot as a depth guy. He brings a lot of intensity and charisma to the defense, but I think he's limited in coverage ability. Perhaps he's going to be used in that "thumper" role and another more versatile LB is our target in the draft?
Barfarn
10 years ago


uffda udfa said:
No... Sam Barrington ran 4.91 at the combine and that is... TERRIBLE. Tangent left, tangent right. Doesn't change a thing.


uffda udfa said:
4.91 is his OFFICIAL 40 time...the one the NFL goes with. I don't see a single soul commenting on how brutal that is...it's as bad as it gets for a LB. Horrid. Nothing but deflections and misdirections and validations for something that is nothing but abysmal.



Barfarn Writes:
You have just fully substantiated what you said w/ your own opinion.

If I may be so bold as to speak for the entire Packer nation: We all know 4.91 is brutal for a LB. But, it means absolutely NOTHING because football speed is one of the components of football athleticism that matters, not track speed.

And perhaps too, that is the # the "NFL goes by;" but I don't know what that means. The Packers and scouts of other teams don't evaluate based on one time; they consider all the 40times SB ran not just one. And now that SB is w/ the Packers, if 4.91 is the # "the NFL goes by" does he get arrested by the 40police if he goes faster than 4.91 during a game?

Again who cares what his 40 time is. Please evaluate his play to show he's not athletic enough. EG, Like in Champ game when Lynch sprinted down the left sideline and SB had him MAN. Sam was only able to stay w/in a foot of Lynch and Wilson lobbed a perfect pass over Sam's head into Lynch's hands for TD; except Sam being a foot away was able to knock ball away...oh wait, darnit I did it again; SB staying w/ Lynch like stink on a fly and exhibiting Chuck Norris-type reflexes to knock ball away is a poor example of how unathletic he is. And no man has ever said Chuck Norris is not athletic enough to his face and lived.

Let's talk football, not track stats. Pick some plays that you believe demonstrates he's not athletic enough and we'll evaluate/discuss..whadda ya say? Heck, ya might even convince me that you're right!

buckeyepackfan
10 years ago
Getting my popcorn ready!

This should be fun!

::d ::d ::d
I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
uffda udfa
10 years ago
Thank you...thank you....thank you. FINALLY. Someone finally admits that 4.91 is just awful for a LB. It is truly amazing it took this deep into this to get someone to do that. I have no issue with the other stuff you typed and I have said I really like Sam as a player. I just wish he was quicker and compared him to Bishop who also lacked in that area but still was a fine player.

The only thing that would make me happier is to see Buck admit that 4.91 is awful, but I know he could never do such a thing.


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Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


Zero2Cool
10 years ago
Pro Day Results
Sam Barrington covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds
Clay Matthews covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=90672&draftyear=2013&genpos=ILB 
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57020&draftyear=2009&genpos=olb 


All this chatter about 40 yard times with LINEBACKERS has me thinking I'm on a Raiders forum.
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uffda udfa
10 years ago

Pro Day Results
Sam Barrington covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds
Clay Matthews covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=90672&draftyear=2013&genpos=ILB 
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57020&draftyear=2009&genpos=olb 


All this chatter about 40 yard times with LINEBACKERS has me thinking I'm on a Raiders forum.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Ha! Not a bad shot. badump bump.

Still, it baffles me how hard everyone seems to be trying to validate Sam based on his number at the combine. His number is his number. NOTHING invalidates that he ran 4.91 at the combine. NOTHING.

Is he really faster than that? I sure hope so. Clay ran 4.67 at the combine and a remarkable 6.90 3 cone.

Pro day results are like Beta vs. VHS. Pro day results are not as valued as electronically timed combine times. Guys are hand timed at pro days. The variations can be ridiculous. That is why what happens at the combine is so important. If it wasn't, why do they hold it at all and why do guys train like maniacs to put their best foot forward? If combine wasn't everything to these guys they could just opt out for their own pro day. They don't do that because they know the true measure is at the combine where the pro day has inflated numbers. You also want to see how a kid is going to perform away from his home element like he most likely will be during his NFL career.

Sam ran horrifically at the combine and I wish he was faster. Wow, how terrible of me to wish we had more speed from that position.


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Ted Thompson sits on his hands per former GM: "because they’ve had 25 fricking years of great quarterbacks. Of course it works. Try it without a special quarterback."


warhawk
10 years ago

Pro Day Results
Sam Barrington covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds
Clay Matthews covered 20 yards in 2.68 seconds


http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=90672&draftyear=2013&genpos=ILB 
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=57020&draftyear=2009&genpos=olb 


All this chatter about 40 yard times with LINEBACKERS has me thinking I'm on a Raiders forum.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Now your getting to stuff that matters. Short range quickness and burst and then go past that to instincts and reaction. It doesn't matter if you run 4.5 if it takes a half a second to recognize and react it's too late. The 49'rs put a short and not all that fast ILB in there last year and all he did was consistantly beat faster and more athletic players to the ball.

I was not sure if Borland's game would translate over to the NFL but boy that kid had instincts and reaction time that was unreal. For an ILB how fast does he get from where he's lined up to where he needs to go to make a play is what is important and the dynamics of all that goes into having that knack of getting to the ball goes far past what he can run 40 yards in.

40 yards you got nothing in front of you and that really doesn't have a who hell of a lot to do with what a LB is staring at every time the ball is snapped. WR's run 40 yards down field and CB's are running with them so yeah, a 40 time is more important in that case.
I don't know what the big deal is on Barrington. I watched him as well as all of you and I never said "geez, that guy is slow." He didn't look to be playing slow to me. Wasn't it also right around when they started playing him that the defense started coming around? I know that wasn't all him but I thought for a young guy really getting his first dose he held up very well.


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