Well, why aren't they playing like demons, then? Our special teams are about average this season. Maybe even worse than average. I would like to think that the solution is as simple as firing the special teams coach. Maybe it is. But I doubt it.

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McCarthy will not fire Stock or Sanders. He doesnt have the balls. And that will ultimately be his downfall.

I hope you are 100% wrong.

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That's a total bull statement IM (I say that with all due respect to you).

Last season, you were critical of MM, until this team got on a roll. By the end of the season, you were talking about how you loved this team.

Well our coaches are the same as they were last season. In about 10 months (time between end of last season and this point) are we to believe that MM, Sanders, Stock, et al have completely changed?

They are now useless? They are completely stupid? Too arrogant?

I say this with all due respect IM, but that's complete crock. MM has always held himself accountable, his staff accountable, and his players accountable.

Last year is proof of that. At times, this year he has come out and said blame has to be put on him and other coaches for not having the team ready to play.

MM will hold all the coaches accountable. However if he thinks they haven't done a bad enough job to be fired... you can't blame him for thinking so.

Last year, they took a virtual unknown and guided them to within a play of making the Superbowl. They haven't regressed by leaps and bounds in less than a year.

They may not have installed the right schemes for this team, but there is no reason to suggest MM values his friendships more than the success of his team, or that he has too much hubris to do what's best for his team.

If the scheme's aren't a fit for our personnel, you better believe MM will get that fixed one way or another. If the coaches have proven themselves of falling short while having good talent, then you better believe MM will address that.

MM is a lot of things. Thick-headed and too stubborn is not one of them.

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+1 to all_about_da_packers, easily one of the most articulate, reasoned posters on the forum, despite the fact I so often disagree with him.

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What they did last year has nothing to do with this year.

The special teams this year have sucked. Stock is in charge of the special teams. They played shitty all year. He is responsible. Thats how it works.

Bob Sanders' blitz's this year are so generic I can spot them from a mile away. HIS defense has choked away game after game. HIS defense has played horribly all season. He is in charge of the defense. He is responsible. Thats how life works.

Excluding the first sentence, I agree with all you've said. I was originally hesitant to criticize Sanders, but I think he has mismanaged his D, and he deserves blame. When so many blitzes fail to get home, at some point you have to start looking at the coaches...

But I disagree big time with you statement that MM is too concerned about maintaining his friendships to do what is best for the team.

I don't think that's the case. As of right now, I think Sanders has to be gone, and Stock's position needs to be under review heavily.

But should they both come back in the same roles next year, I don't think it's fair to say MM is afraid of holding his coaches accountable for their ineptitude.

Nothing suggests MM does that. I'd much rather see Sanders and Stock fired (if MM thinks they need to be) at the end of the season, so the incoming coaches can have the full amount of time to implement the things they want, to install the philosophy and scheme they think best.

Forcing a coach to fire two coaches in the middle of the season, only to have the replacements run and call a scheme they might not agree with isn't going to solve the problem.

Not firing the coaches during the season also doesn't mean that the HC is too soft.

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Damn, I hate AAPD. Every time I have an opinion I firmly believe in he demolishes it with a wall of text like that.

But I remain with my opinion that we have lots of coaching issues and something needs to be done.

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Regarding the Jarett Bush situation there:

He simply got man handled into that ball, IMO. He didn't have a chance to get out of the way, because he was clearly being held by the defender and he couldn't move outta the way. So it's definitely not entirely his fault, if at all.

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Bush was doing exactly what he was supposed to be doing. Bush's back was to the return guy, he was engaged in a block. It was just bad luck (or a good play by the Bears gunner getting him into position to be hit by the ball).

In addition to the other special teams woes, 15 weeks into the season, we still have issues covering kickoffs. I lay that on the special teams coach. As McCarthy is fond of saying (or, at least says repeatedly), "We've got to get that fixed." For whatever reason, Stock's been unable to do that. IMO, it's time to move on.

I don't think that McCarthy will fire Sanders/Stock. He's a first time head coach, and I think he's going to keep them on staff out of a show of loyalty to his subordinates.