Porforis
8 years ago

After Cobb went out Rodgers played really well. With 2 minutes in 3rd Q we had the lead and the ball. Had Rodgers continued to play the exact same way: there never would have been an OT; we never would have needed 2 stupid luck hail marys; and our D would not have had to take the field in OT after playing 25 plays in 4th Q. Heck the D even got an INT in the 4th quarter and still Palmer completely outplayed Rodgers for the last 17 minutes. THAT IS WHY WE LOST!

Now if we want to look for excuses we can find them, all the weapons were out, really? Boy, not having any weapons didn't slow Rodgers in 2 and 3rd Q of AZ game or in the 1st half of Atl game, now didn't it? You cant have it both ways! If Rodgers is elite he can work with mediocre weapons; if he needs superior weapons to produce, then he's Mark Sanchez. You gotta pick one or the other, can't keep flip-flopping!!!

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 



This displays a common irrational bias towards performance in the fourth quarter. Two quarterbacks who have the exact same talent and skillset and performance should be basically equal, right? This doesn't apply when one QB does well in Qs 1 and 2, okay in 3, and trails off most games in the fourth (who is perceived as overrated because he can't "close out" games)... And the other is perceived as better because he plays meh in the first quarter, starts warming up in the second, and then plays well in Qs 3 and 4. This implies that points are more valuable in one quarter than another. Some of this is that it's the last impression left with you, towards the end of the game things seem more dramatic and important than earlier in the game when in actuality, a QB whose offense scores 14-14-7-0 points in each quarter will tie a quarterback who goes 0-7-14-14. 7 points is 7 points no matter when you score them.

The only logical argument for this bias I can think of is when you have the last possession of the game, and you need to score. Initially it would appear that a QB that is above average at this will win more games than one that is below average, but similar to the situation above, if the QB also can't get points closing out the first half, it's a wash.

We get it. You have a poor opinion of Rodgers. I have my own complaints, but I don't put the horse blinders on and irrationally attack one piece of a much more complex puzzle. Palmer outplayed Rodgers for the final 17 minutes - Rodger's performance factors into this, but Palmer's defense and the poor performance of the Packers defense also played into it. And what about playcalling? All criticism of McCarthy's conservative playcalling and Capers playing prevent seem to go out the window when an opportunity to criticize Rodgers comes around. It's not an all or nothing thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias 
Zero2Cool
8 years ago
We Packers fans have been so freaking incredibly blessed to have Brett Favre followed by Aaron Rodgers, it's absurd.

And now Aaron Rodgers has regressed from his God like elite domination and some are going to label him Jay Cutler?
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Porforis
8 years ago

We Packers fans have been so freaking incredibly blessed to have Brett Favre followed by Aaron Rodgers, it's absurd.

And now Aaron Rodgers has regressed from his God like elite domination and some are going to label him Jay Cutler?

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



It's funny that you say that, because I feel like Jay Cutler has always got a bad rap, and not all of that is fair and in a lot of cases, is attributed to his body language/facial expressions.

Jay Cutler is not a great QB and never will be.
Jay Cutler is not a bad QB either. He's more or less middle of the road, our fairly consistent success against him skews our perception of him. How many times has Jay been out and some other QB comes in that everyone thinks will change the Bears' fortune, only to have them stink it up just as bad or worse? The Bears have many more notable problems than Jay Cutler. If you throw Tom Brady in there, they're not winning 10 games.

Jay's got a notable downside in his ability to protect the ball, but he's also got a lot of upside. A QB that can't get the ball downfield or manage games won't do jack for you even if he isn't throwing a pick or two a game like Cutler seems to.
Barfarn
8 years ago

Aaron Rodgers and the Packers put up 32 points. The loss is on the defense that couldn't get the Falcons off the field in their final drive.

Aaron Rodgers went 28 of 38 with 246 yards passing with 4 TD's. If you think he's the reason the Packers loss, you're a complete spoiled bitch ass fan who doesn't understand the game. And that's okay. Every fan base has its turds.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 





I just don't understand how you can place 95% of the blame on one player. Really, you won't get 5% from some combination of the defense, punter (to be fair, he had a good game last week) punting 30-35 yard stinkers, and playcalling on both sides of the ball? Did Rodgers run over your dog and then make out with your wife or something? 75%? I'd definitely disagree but it's semi-reasonable but there's room for debate. 95% just shows an irrational hatred for an individual player.

Originally Posted by: Porforis 



You are hilarious Porforis! I'm sure your question was rhetorical LOL, but I'll answer: no, Rodgers didn't do anything to me personally. I just evaluate what what each player is supposed to do and judge their performance on that and only that. That's why I was so certain the Bears would beat Minn. Also, I didn't say Rodgers was 95% responsible for Atl loss, I said he 95% responsible for why we cant "seal the deal."

The Defense lost the game; Rodgers is great. This is exactly how the FAN makes his determinations by looking at stats without actually WATCHING THE GAME. This is why Mike says, “Stats are for losers.”

On last drive our DBs and LB mostly blanketed the receivers and the pass rush was very good to solid, this was symptomatic of the entire game. People get all mad at the result, I go back and look at each play and ask, "okay, who effed up." And sometimes you find out no one did. This is what happened when we played SD last year and our D was not the problem in Atlanta. Our problem was a hot Ryan. Today the Defensive players are going to get their grades and they’re all going to be pretty damn good!

When a QB gets hot, and the other 10 players dont get stupid all D's will give up a bunch of points. This is because especially with today’s rules there is no defense against the perfect pass, a DB can only knock down a less than perfect pass, the worse the coverage the less perfect the pass needs to be. Did Minny;s defense suddenly suck? the Bears were missing 2 of 3 top WRs and their 2 starting guards and Center and they destroyed Minny's defense. But Minny's D didn't totally suck, Cutler was just playing like, well, Aaron Rodgers.

Now when the other team's QB gets hot and ya dont get turnovers or big ST palys, there's only one way to win, you must out score them. This means your O must play great. If your paying the QB $2-3M or less, then you can pay for a great OL and weapons; but if QB is making $22M, the weapons and OL will be less. Now last night, can't blame things on Bradford, though he did screw up a few times big, but he got the crap kicked out of him, his OL stunk. For GB in Atl, the OL played great, now it gets very simple, to win our QB must play better than Ryan. Rodgers’ passes were less perfect that Ryan’s even though Ryan suffered more pressure. Their QB was better, a lot better if you consider the relative pressure, THIS IS WHY WE LOST, no other reason. A lot of Ryan’s being better was due to him standing in the pocket like a man and getting hit several times. Conversely, Rodgers sometimes during the first 8 drives prematurely ran scared out of the pocket and chronically on last drive, this is why Ryan was more accurate in the game and completely out performed Rodgers when it counted.

The failure of the last drive was 100% Rodgers' fault, as I described above. On the two punts to begin 2nd half, Allison dropped one, Tretter I think missed a block for a sack, so Rodgers might have only been 50-60-70-80% or whatever % at fault. When the entire O is executing except the $22M man, I place the blame where it belongs. Last year, I [and Nerd] looked at his play, and the play of the others on O, this is why only Packershome readers got the real low down on Rodgers before the rest of the media caught on this year. In last 2 weeks his stats are better, he is playing better. But. part of the reason for his stats being better is we're playing crappy teams, he'd have a 158.3 PR if we played a high school team. At this point he's still falling short of a guy who can win 3-4 straight games against a playoff teams, and it's 99% attitude. So until until he improves his mind set, which will improve his play, he just "same ole' Jay."

On last drive the Ds worst plays:
* the screen pass, a great call, Jones and Clark reacted well, the O executed well but only got 8 yards as the D recovered.
*There was an out to Sanu; but Hyde was illegally picked. It was pretty subtle and the zebras missed it, but Hyde recovered brilliantly. No DB could have played that better.
* they did a zone blitz with Hyde and Sanu was the hot read and Ryan hit the hot read, just like Rodgers used to do; and he got 9. He probably should have only gotten 5-6, as either Dix or Goodson dropped a touch too deep in the zone. But not a real big mistake.
*Just as Perry got to Ryan, Ryan hit an out to Sanu and Goodson had less than great coverage, but was in good enough coverage to limit the play to 8 yards.
* Not sure what happened on TD, but again Perry was an eyelash from the sack. If they were in a hybrid cover 3, with Dix/Gunter bracketing Julio, then Goodson’s failure to cover deep right caused Burnett to cover deep right leaving middle open. If they were in a hybrid man with the Julio bracket, then Martinez was suppose to take the TE deep right and Burnett would have been there for Sanu. So either Goodson or Martinez is getting a demerit for that TD. Though if I’m Capers and I got Hyde on Freeman, which was necessary, then I play in dime, but then you trade Martinez for Brice.

Zero2Cool
8 years ago
^^^^ (sorry lol)



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DoddPower
8 years ago
lol Barfan is hilarious. I just regret I wasted two minutes of my life again reading his first couple posts when he is on the Rodgers-hating bandwagon. I know better than to waste time reading that nonsensical diatribe.

The bottom line is that Aaron Rodgers played well enough to win this game. Could he have played better? Sure. So could the rest of the team. But he contributed more than enough. If the rest of the team contributed half as much as Aaron Rodgers did to this game, the Packers would have easily won.

I have no doubt that Aaron Rodgers wishes he played better. But I'm not going to slam the guy because he wasn't perfect. That's stupid. He had little-to-no running game (other than himself), limited healthy offensive weapons, average pass protection at best, and a swiss cheese defense. I think he still did pretty well under those circumstances. I hope he plays better, but I'm not going to hold him to any unrealistic expectations, at least without holding every other Packers player and coach to those same expectations.
Porforis
8 years ago

Also, I didn't say Rodgers was 95% responsible for Atl loss, I said he 95% responsible for why we cant "seal the deal."

The Defense lost the game; Rodgers is great. This is exactly how the FAN makes his determinations by looking at stats without actually WATCHING THE GAME. This is why Mike says, “Stats are for losers.”

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 



If you paid any attention to my body of posts, I put conscious effort into giving due criticism whenever I'm "defending" Rodgers, or any other aspect of the team. You clearly have an obsession with Aaron Rodgers and take every opportunity possible to blame him for a situation. Yes I was being facetious, but my point was that you're coming off as if this is a very emotional or personal issue for you, as your blame and rage is singularly focused on one player.

Conversely, Rodgers sometimes during the first 8 drives prematurely ran scared out of the pocket and chronically on last drive, this is why Ryan was more accurate in the game and completely out performed Rodgers when it counted.

Originally Posted by: Barfarn 



This just as easily could be phrased as "The Falcons defense sometimes during the first 8 drives was doing a great job at flushing Rodgers out of the pocket and forcing him to make throws on the run which aren't as accurate. This is why Ryan was able to perform better, because the Packers defense was not able to prevent him from having a largely clean pocket."

It is a fact that the Packers were not generating much of any pass rush. In the last drive on particular, the Falcons rushed 3 men against at least 6 back in pass protection and got to Rodgers within 3 seconds. That's a complete and utter embarrassment. Just to avoid having it insinuated that I'm a blind Rodgers fanboy that doesn't blame him for anything, he didn't play scared much the first 3 quarters but reverted to his earlier form in the 4th quarter which didn't help matters at all. He's also become less accurate when rolling out. He's got some confidence back which is good, but some of his mechanics are still fucked up and it's concerning that he'll still get happy feet after a while.

My main point is, blaming complex situations on a 53 man football team in the NFL where every week we play someone new with different coaches and officiating on a single player is positively ridiculous.
Porforis
8 years ago

lol Barfan is hilarious. I just regret I wasted two minutes of my life again reading his first couple posts when he is on the Rodgers-hating bandwagon. I know better than to waste time reading that nonsensical diatribe.

The bottom line is that Aaron Rodgers played well enough to win this game. Could he have played better? Sure. So could the rest of the team. But he contributed more than enough. If the rest of the team contributed half as much as Aaron Rodgers did to this game, the Packers would have easily won.

I have no doubt that Aaron Rodgers wishes he played better. But I'm not going to slam the guy because he wasn't perfect. That's stupid. He had little-to-no running game (other than himself), limited healthy offensive weapons, average pass protection at best, and a swiss cheese defense. I think he still did pretty well under those circumstances. I hope he plays better, but I'm not going to hold him to any unrealistic expectations, at least without holding every other Packers player and coach to those same expectations.

Originally Posted by: DoddPower 



While I'm sure this will be interpreted as a blind defense of Your Lord Savior Aaron Rodgers, I do want to believe that people that have a hard time looking at matters objectively are capable of both being aware of, and consciously trying to combat confirmation bias and generally listening to other points of view, and humoring them and taking them at face value. I mean, our race is pretty much fucked otherwise - look at what it's gotten us this election cycle. The facts don't matter on either side because we've got a boogeyman/woman and we have an excuse to look at an insanely complex array of issues as if it were a simple problem we could blame on one or two things. But again, I want to have faith that at least some people can be shown that hey, maybe I'm being a BIT too intense and should try looking at things a different way?
DoddPower
8 years ago

While I'm sure this will be interpreted as a blind defense of Your Lord Savior Aaron Rodgers, I do want to believe that people that have a hard time looking at matters objectively are capable of both being aware of, and consciously trying to combat confirmation bias and generally listening to other points of view, and humoring them and taking them at face value. I mean, our race is pretty much fucked otherwise - look at what it's gotten us this election cycle. The facts don't matter on either side because we've got a boogeyman/woman and we have an excuse to look at an insanely complex array of issues as if it were a simple problem we could blame on one or two things. But again, I want to have faith that at least some people can be shown that hey, maybe I'm being a BIT too intense and should try looking at things a different way?

Originally Posted by: Porforis 



There are very few Packers fans that would say Aaron Rodgers have been playing "great" or even "well" recently. But he played good enough against the Falcons. It could be better, but it could be much worse. Perhaps Aaron Rodgers isn't an "elite" QB anymore. Who cares. He's still much better than many others. Take what we can get and improve the rest of the team so that Aaron Rodgers doesn't have to play perfect for the Packers to beat good teams. That should be a primary objective.
dhazer
8 years ago

Win what? Games? Playoff games? The super bowl? 2/32 teams make it every year, and the Packers have made it to the playoffs every year except for what, two under McCarthy/Rodgers? And one super bowl victory. Yes, we've underachieved. But to pretend we're anywhere approaching one of the only teams that blows leads and doesn't execute in the fourth quarter, and otherwise underperformed is quite laughable, as my recap of the Falcons' and Matt Ryan's season illustrated. Everyone thought the Vikings were cream of the crop this season until they dropped two stinkers too. Every team's fans (except the Browns and Bears) think their team is good enough to go at LEAST 12-4. How many teams per year actually make that mark? Apart from the Patriots and Broncos, what teams would you point to as an excellent example of sustained success and playing up to their level of talent consistently?

Originally Posted by: Porforis 



As I said before we are in the Sherman years 2.0 now. Our elite qb isn't elite anymore he is just good. Our main players are getting old and don't stay on the field, and we will somehow get into the playoffs with no real hope of winning it all. Mike McCarthy and Rodgers are used to the one and dones and this year will probably be another one. I say we should have dumped Matthews, Peppers, Cobb all at the trading deadline. Hell and I will stick to my guns of trading Rodgers to the Browns for their next 4 #1's lol.

Now for the game can someone please explain to me why dipshit didn't call a TO once they got to the 10 yard line on the final drive? Your defense isn't stopping them and you save yourself some time. So you call a TO with 59 sec left and they scored on the very next play you would have 50 secs left now 30 secs. But we know better Mike McCarthy and Rodgers like to waste a TO in each half.
Just Imagine this for the next 6-9 years. What a ride it will be 🙂 (PS, Zero should charge for this)
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Mucky Tundra (20-Nov) : Matt LaFleur without context: “I don’t wanna pat you on the butt and you poop in my hand.”
beast (20-Nov) : We brought in a former Packers OL coach to help evaluate OL as a scout
beast (20-Nov) : Jets have been pretty good at picking DL
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He landed good players thanks to high draft slot. He isn't good.
Zero2Cool (20-Nov) : He can shove his knowledge up his ass. He knows nothing.
beast (20-Nov) : More knowledge, just like bring in the Jets head coach
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : What? Why? Huh?
beast (19-Nov) : I wonder if the Packers might to try to bring Douglas in through Milt Hendrickson/Ravens connections
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : The Jets fired Joe Douglas, per sources
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Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Jets sign Anders Carlson to their 53.
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packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the total and percentage are the same as the previous weeks
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : the totals are accurate..nrvrtmind
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : I don't follow what you are saying. The totals are not the same as last week.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : ok so then wht are the totals the same as last week?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : NFL Pick'em is auto updated when NFL Scores tab is clicked
Martha Careful (19-Nov) : The offense was OK. Let's not forget the Bear defense is very very good.
packerfanoutwest (19-Nov) : Who updates the leaderboard on NFLPickem?
beast (19-Nov) : Has the Packers offense been worse since the former Jets coach joined the Packers?
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Offense gets his ass in gear, this could be good.
Zero2Cool (19-Nov) : Backup QB helped with three wins. Special Teams contributed to three wins.
bboystyle (18-Nov) : Lions played outside thats why. They scored 16 and 17 in the only 2 outside games this year
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : The rest of the NFL is catching up to Packers ... kicking is an issue throughout league
packerfanoutwest (18-Nov) : Packers DL Kenny Clark: We knew 'we were going to block' Bears' game-winning field goal attempt
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Lions seem to be throttling everyone, but only (only) got 24 lol maybe the rain is why
Zero2Cool (18-Nov) : Packers vs Lions game doesn't seem so bad.
beast (18-Nov) : Dennis Green "They are what we thought they were, and we let them off the hook!"
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : comment of the day Z2Cool "Bears better than we want to admit. Packers worse than we think. It's facts."
Mucky Tundra (17-Nov) : my worst case scenario: Bears fix their oline and get a coach like Johnson from the Lions and his scheme
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Bears get OL fixed amd we might have a problem
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Pretty sure they already have scouting reports on guys who aren't even starting for their college team. The future is now for me.
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : I tend to let Gute and Co. Worry about the future.
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
beast (17-Nov) : That's great news and Packers need to keep upgrading their OL, DL and DBs this off-season, so missing one guy doesn't kill them
buckeyepackfan (17-Nov) : Jaire and Evans Williams are both ACTIVE! Good news.
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : The badgers really need to change the whole offensive scheme. No draws no screens plus the quarterback is marginal
Cheesey (17-Nov) : If the Badgers had a decent QB, they would have won. The guy can't hit a wide open receiver
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : chop block
Martha Careful (17-Nov) : there was a very questionable job Block call that upon viewing replay was very borderline
beast (17-Nov) : How so? (I didn't watch)
Zero2Cool (17-Nov) : Badgers got hosed vs Oregon
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