Cheesey
11 years ago
SOOO true, Dakota!
A great QB can make a so-so WR into a star.

He won't know what he had till he's gone.
UserPostedImage
play2win
11 years ago

Jermichael Finley offers a lot more to the team than you seem to realize. Yes, I believe he is over paid, but he played well through the last half of the season. This hating on Finley isn't cool, its naive. If one wants to hate, they should aim it no further than James Campen.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



Now, wait a minute. I am not hating on anybody. I'm looking at overall performance, and comparing to the overall cost to the team. I have nothing against him at all as a person. If he continues to be a part of this team, I will root for his success as a Green Bay Packer. However, as a fan of the team, I see he came into a very important season, playing an integral role on the team, and failed for half the season to make an impact as a receiver, and failed for the entire season to make an impact as a blocker. And, that's worth how much? Let me get this straight, this selling of him as a decoy that the opposition has to prepare for is worth $7M?

I do not hate. I'm just not thrilled with his approach to the game, his boisterousness, and his all too often ineffective play that continues to fail to live up to his own words. Year after year. Give me a TE that runs the right routes, catches the football, and blocks his man. I'll take that any day. Finley is not that guy. Is he? Game 1 through 16?
play2win
11 years ago

Now, wait a minute. I am not hating on anybody. I'm looking at overall performance, and comparing to the overall cost to the team. I have nothing against him at all as a person. If he continues to be a part of this team, I will root for his success as a Green Bay Packer. However, as a fan of the team, I see he came into a very important season, playing an integral role on the team, and failed for half the season to make an impact as a receiver, and failed for the entire season to make an impact as a blocker. And, that's worth how much? Let me get this straight, this selling of him as a decoy that the opposition has to prepare for is worth $7M?

I do not hate. I'm just not thrilled with his approach to the game, his boisterousness, and his all too often ineffective play that continues to fail to live up to his own words. Year after year. Give me a TE that runs the right routes, catches the football, and blocks his man. I'll take that any day. Finley is not that guy. Is he? Game 1 through 16?

Originally Posted by: play2win 



Here is a power ranking of the top TEs in the NFL:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000110848/article/tight-end-power-rankings-rob-gronkowski-the-best 

Jermichael Finely is ranked 14th in the NFL, middle of the pack.

Here is a ranking of the top salaries for TEs in the NFL:
http://www.csnne.com/football-new-england-patriots/patriots-talk/Gronkowski-not-highest-paid-tight-end-in?blockID=721734 

Please, Jermichael Finley gets paid MORE than Rob Gronkowski? Finley is the 4th highest paid TE in the NFL? Wow.

Nuff said.
Zero2Cool
11 years ago

Here is a power ranking of the top TEs in the NFL:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000110848/article/tight-end-power-rankings-rob-gronkowski-the-best 

Jermichael Finely is ranked 14th in the NFL, middle of the pack.

Here is a ranking of the top salaries for TEs in the NFL:
http://www.csnne.com/football-new-england-patriots/patriots-talk/Gronkowski-not-highest-paid-tight-end-in?blockID=721734 

Please, Jermichael Finley gets paid MORE than Rob Gronkowski? Finley is the 4th highest paid TE in the NFL? Wow.

Nuff said.

Originally Posted by: play2win 



How is that enough said when it simply restates my point about Finley being overpaid? Are you saying I ended it already and you threw down some keystrokes for attention? 🙂

I trust PFF more than your link and of TE's whom played 50% or more of the snaps, Finley is rated 28th. And also as I stated, he started to really come on in the second half of the season, which if you look at his statistics and ratings, that is also proven too.

Edit, keep in mind, Finley was playing through a shoulder injury during a portion of the first half the season too.
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DakotaT
11 years ago
I recall everybody being very satisfied with the two year deal Finley signed - now he's overpaid when the bigger year needs to be shelled out? This issue with Finley is not his contract, it's his attitude and maturity.

Thinking back to the 2010 season when he got injured, has anybody ever given Quarless the praises he deserved for his role in our championship. With blocking and receiving considered, he's probably our best tight end.
UserPostedImage
Zero2Cool
11 years ago

I recall everybody being very satisfied with the two year deal Finley signed - now he's overpaid when the bigger year needs to be shelled out? This issue with Finley is not his contract, it's his attitude and maturity.

Thinking back to the 2010 season when he got injured, has anybody ever given Quarless the praises he deserved for his role in our championship. With blocking and receiving considered, he's probably our best tight end.

Originally Posted by: DakotaT 



You recall everybody being satisfied huh? - link 
UserPostedImage
play2win
11 years ago

How is that enough said when it simply restates my point about Finley being overpaid? Are you saying I ended it already and you threw down some keystrokes for attention? 🙂

I trust PFF more than your link and of TE's whom played 50% or more of the snaps, Finley is rated 28th. And also as I stated, he started to really come on in the second half of the season, which if you look at his statistics and ratings, that is also proven too.

Edit, keep in mind, Finley was playing through a shoulder injury during a portion of the first half the season too.

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



I was taking exception to the hater comment - no big thing Zero2Cool. Offered some very quick access articles on salary and performance. That is all this is about. I know he turned some things around in the 2nd half of the season. But, we needed him for the full season, and he was paid for the full season. That, to me, is not a good return on investment. And, we're not even discussing his blocking...

I guess the bigger thing in all of this is looking at the thresholds, where performance and pay are in line, and forecasting those that are looking to be out of line, then making the hard decisions. As a fan, we don't have much say, and for all I know the light will go on for Jermichael Finley next season. If that does happen, I do hope it is in a Packers uniform. I understand the development of players is not as cut and dried as we all might like for it to be. Finley is their guy, and they've made a pretty big financial commitment to him, along with their continued praise and encouragement from the staff.
blueleopard
11 years ago

Closing? For a QB at 29 years old and what 5 seasons of duty under his belt and we are closing that window already? Brady, Manning, Favre types have shown that you can play at a high level well into the late 30's. We are far from closing the window.

Every team reloads.. turns over the roster in a planned manner. Nelson and Cobb were brought in to prepare for DD and Jennings leaving. Loading up the secondary was in preparation of Woodson leaving.

It happens.. and the Packers had that plan in place for when it happened.

We have issues to fix.. heck we have had them for a couple of seasons now.. but this team is far from being depleted.

Originally Posted by: Pack93z 



You're just re-stating what I said in longer verbiage. I know Rodgers is talented, and he'll be like that for a long time, but like Brady, Manning, and Favre -- he won't be able to do it alone. I'd argue that he'd do it better than all the guys you mentioned, but if he continues to take 50 sacks a year, it's not gonna happen.

No offense, but did you watch the National Championship game?

musccy wrote:



Yes, but you can't let that overshadow is entire body of work for that season. You aren't chosen as the runner-up for the Heisman Trophy for no reason, especially as a defensive player.

Te'o is the most instinctive sideline-to-sideline leader in the middle I've seen come out in a very long time. Yes, he was overmatched in the National Championship -- but you have to take into account the Crimson Tide having an offensive line full of draftable guys. Not to mention that aside from Louis Nix, there's nobody that's going to be drafted out of the Notre Dame defensive this year other than Te'o.
Danreb Victorio A Believer of Greg Jennings
buckeyepackfan
11 years ago
Packers have let their all-time yardage receiver retire, they are probably letting go to their "1 reciever of over the past 3 years, quedtionable whether their #1 TE will be back.
That's a lot of experience to replace just on the offensive side.

The Packers released their #1 DB, 2009 DPOY, prob. 1st rnd HOF candidate.
Questionable that their 2012 staring ML(Jones RFA) will be back,
Questionable that their 2012 starting OLB opposite Mathews (Walden) will be back,
and still a majority if you want to shit can the one LB who has been a rock at whatever position he has been asked to play.
Leading tackler in 2012, leading tackler on the team since he was drafted, started every game(but 2 in 2011}.

Yet with all the other ? this team has on defense, it seems that some of you think A.J. Hawk is the biggest problem The Packers have.

PLEASE TED CUT A.J. HAWK, absorb the 5 mil hit on the salary cap, GET HIS ASS OUT OF GREEN BAY, I for 1 am tired of the yearly A.J. Hawk has to go threads.

DAMMIT TED JUST DO IT!!!!

So some of the members can move on to their next most hated guy.

I was addicted to The Hokey Pokey, but I turned myself around!
play2win
11 years ago
There's that "hate" word again. Man, I just see that he is not the fastest MLB in the NFL, probably not in the top half. His coverage is lacking, is it not? He gets paid giant coin, and he's a great guy, and upstanding representative of our team on and off the field, but, what about the production? Tackles stats are deceiving. Yes, he has done a great job, and I've said many times this season how much his play looks to have been improved. Yet, he is not a LB that opponents have to game plan for. Is he?

Well, to me, being paid as much as he is, he should be.

This has nothing to do with liking the player or not.

I put some comparisons up in another thread a while ago. The SF LBs are touted top to bottom as being one of the best units in the NFL. What is it going to take for us to reach that level? Upgrading the unit. You mentioned Brad Jones, and Eric Walden, like they would be some kind of great loss to this team. Really? Why? What have they done? Get them the F out!!!!

Bring in a couple more LBs to pair with Hawk and Matthews. Fine. Maybe Hawk's play improves even further with better talent around him. All I know is other teams exposed the middle of the field against us for some time now. Historical running running totals against us. Historical passing days against us. A lot of that in the middle of our D where Hawk has been a high priced mainstay.

Is Hawk going to become faster with better talent around him? Ted Thompson drafted him very high. He continues to pay him high. It is just my opinion that we are paying way more than what we are getting in return.

Hawk's cap figure is $6.5M (salary 4.9M)
Franchise Tag LB figure is $8.3M
Average salary for LB is $1.2M

For comparison, Patrick Willis has a cap figure of $5M and a salary of $1.9M

Hawk is paid better than many LBs in this NFL. Is AJ Hawks play in the top 20? In February of 2012, there was a ranking of the top 50 Linebackers in the NFL. Matthews was ranked #4 overall. Des Bishop was ranked #39 overall. Hawk didn't even make the list.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1078774-nfl-power-ranking-the-top-50-active-linebackers/page/2 

In April of 2012, they ranked the top 40 Inside Linebackers. Hawk was ranked #32
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1129638-br-nfl-1000-top-40-inside-linebackers/page/10 

I know you are a fan of his buckeyepackfan, and that's cool. I really like the guy myself. I just think we may need to upgrade, or at the very least get a pay cut in place and get some better players around him.
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    beast (4h) : Sounds like no serious injuries from the Saints game and Jacobs and Watson should play in the Vikings game
    packerfanoutwest (9h) : both games Watson missed, Packers won
    Martha Careful (10h) : I hope all of you have a Merry Christmas!
    Mucky Tundra (20h) : Oh I know about Jacobs, I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mimic Zero lol
    buckeyepackfan (21h) : Jacobs was just sat down, Watson re-injured that knee that kept him out 1 game earlier
    buckeyepackfan (21h) : I needed .14 that's. .14 points for the whole 4th quarter to win and go to the SB. Lol
    Mucky Tundra (21h) : Jacobs gonna be OK???
    Zero2Cool (21h) : Watson gonna be OK???
    packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : Inactives tonight for the Pack: Alexander- knee Bullard - ankle Williams - quad Walker -ankle Monk Heath
    packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : No Jaire, but hopefully the front 7 destroys the line of scrimmage & forces Rattler into a few passes to McKinney.
    packerfanoutwest (24-Dec) : minny could be #1 seed and the Lions #5 seed
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : We'd have same Division and Conference records. Strength of schedule we edge them
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I just checked. What tie breaker?
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes its possible but unlikely. If we do get the 5th, we face the NFCS winner
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ahh, ok.
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : yes due to tie breaker
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I mean, unlikely, yes, but mathematically, 5th is possible by what I'm reading.
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : If Vikings lose out, Packers win out, Packers get 5th, right?
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : Minny isnt going to lose out so 5th seed is out of the equation. We are playing for the 6th or 7th seed which makes no difference
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, the ad revenue goes to the broadcast company but they gotta pay to air the game on their channel/network
    beast (23-Dec) : If we win tonight the game is still relative in terms of 5th, 6th or 7th seed... win and it's 5th or 6th, lose and it's 6th or 7th
    beast (23-Dec) : Mucky, I thought the ad revenue went to the broadcasting companies or the NFL, at least not directly
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think the revenue share is moot, isn't it? That's the CBA an Salary Cap handling that.
    bboystyle (23-Dec) : i mean game becomes irrelevant if we win tonight. Just a game where we are trying to play spoilers to Vikings chance at the #1 seed
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : beast, I would guess ad revenue from more eyes watching tv
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I would think it would hurt the home team because people would have to cancel last minute maybe? i dunno
    beast (23-Dec) : I agree that it's BS for fans planning on going to the game. But how does it bring in more money? I'm guessing indirectly?
    packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : bs on flexing the game....they do it for the $$league$$, not the hometown fans
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I see what you did there Mucky
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : dammit. 3:25pm
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Packers Vikings flexed to 3:35pm
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Upon receiving the news about Luke Musgrave, I immediately fell to the ground
    Mucky Tundra (23-Dec) : Yeah baby!
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : LUKE MUSGRAVE PLAYING TONIGHT~!~~~~WOWHOAAOHAOAA yah
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I wanna kill new QB's ... blitz the crap out of them.
    beast (23-Dec) : Barry seemed to get too conservative against new QBs, Hafley doesn't have that issue
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : However, we seem to struggle vs new QB's
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Should be moot point, cuz Packers should win tonight.
    packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : ok I stand corrected
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : Ok, yes, you are right. I see that now how they get 7th
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : 5th - Packers win out, Vikings lose out. Maybe?
    beast (23-Dec) : Saying no to the 6th lock.
    beast (23-Dec) : No, with the Commanders beating the Eagles, Packers could have a good chance of 6th or 7th unless the win out
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I think if Packers win, they are locked 6th with chance for 5th.
    beast (23-Dec) : But it doesn't matter, as the Packers win surely win one of their remaining games
    beast (23-Dec) : This is not complex, just someone doesn't want to believe reality
    beast (23-Dec) : We already have told you... if Packers lose all their games (they won't, but if they did), and Buccaneers and Falcons win all theirs
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I posted it in that Packers and 1 seed thread
    Zero2Cool (23-Dec) : I literally just said it.
    packerfanoutwest (23-Dec) : show us a scenario where Pack don't get in? bet you can't
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