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Offline DakotaT  
#16 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 8:24:14 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
1 - 2 - 3 with 3,000 + killed - that's not common enough? And of course, there's the factor of a lot worse weaponry than what hit us in 9/11.

I expect lunacy in here from these Libertarian/anarchist/whatever types who wouldn't know the meaning of priority if it bit them in the ass hahahaha, but fortunately, there is a population out there that allows common sense to be the rule - loss of life AND loss of freedom trumps mere loss of freedom - which in point of fact, isn't even happening. Who among us - REALISTICALLY - not letting your paranoia run wild, feels any less free because of the TSA or any other provisions of the Patriot Act? I can honestly say, I have NOT been affected one iota - but then I don't have a secret drug stash or a marijuana crop in the backyard or a thriving criminal enterprise hahahaha.



Yeah, and in the back of your mind you are all for "population control" in other countries of course, just can't be the red, white, and blue blood dying.

I don't fly much, so yeah, my freedoms haven't been infringed upon too much. But then again, I'm not loony teabagger who listens to Beck, Rush, and O'reilly - for "knowledge".
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Online texaspackerbacker  
#17 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 10:58:28 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
Yeah, and in the back of your mind you are all for "population control" in other countries of course, just can't be the red, white, and blue blood dying.

I don't fly much, so yeah, my freedoms haven't been infringed upon too much. But then again, I'm not loony teabagger who listens to Beck, Rush, and O'reilly - for "knowledge".


You got that right!!! Let that trash from other countries kill each other off in big numbers, God damned Muslims especially. I remember the Iran/Iraq War in the 80s, I wanted that thing to go on forever - evil killing evil! Sunni v. Shiite? They know exactly how little their lives are worth. We in this country - with the exception of a few reverse ethnocentrists like you, Dakota, CARE about the valuable blood of our own - and in many cases, myself absolutely included, don't give a damn about the blood of trash people killing other trash people in their own trash countries.

Beck you're probably right. His outlook is pretty loony, much like the paranoid bunch in this forum. O'Reilly and Rush, however, are pretty well grounded in their priorities - rights and freedoms being important, but paling to insignifcance in comparison to risking lives.

But the real stupidity of this, I say again, is that nobody is giving up any rights and freedoms anyway - unless they are a druggie or criminal, and FOR SURE, those precious rights and freedoms the paranoia crowd is so worried about would be down the toilet in the aftermath of a major terrorist event. How dense can you guys be not to realize that?
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Online texaspackerbacker  
#18 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 11:09:24 AM(UTC)
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What gets me, with the plethora of PARANOIA being posted in here about stuff that ain't happening anyway or ain't affecting anybody of the good normal people, nobody in here seems to get upset about the LITTLE stuff that really does affect all of us every day. I started a thread about this, and it got practically no response. I'm talking about the stupid damn seat belt and child seat laws, the veritable outbreak of new stoplights, and worse, left turn signals - for what? to give an advantage to the less competent drivers while they delay and annoy all the good normal people. And that annoying extra couple of seconds after a damn red light before it turns green the other way! Also, so so many idiotic local rules and regulations intruding into our lives - REAL instead of theoretical shit like harm from the Patriot Act. Doesn't THAT SHIT which really does affect your life irritate you paranoid guys? And NONE of that stupid shit ever gets voted on; It is just put in effect - ho hum - by God damned bureaucrats - who think they know more than the good normal people who are being inconvenienced. You guys rant and whine and rant and whine about stuff that has absolutely no effect on your daily life, and then seemingly no outrage over this rapidly expanding shitstorm of intrusive small-time stuff.
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If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline Zero2Cool  
#19 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 11:12:54 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: DakotaT Go to Quoted Post
But then again, I'm not loony teabagger who listens to Beck, Rush, and O'reilly - for "knowledge".


The hell is wrong with Beck and Rush?

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Formo on 6/18/2013(UTC)
Offline Formo  
#20 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 12:07:58 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: dfosterf Go to Quoted Post
I wanna go fishin' with Wade, Shawn, Jeremy, and Texas.

That would be a good fishing trip.



I'm afraid there wouldn't be much fish being caught. And there wouldn't be any guarantee that I throw some of you guys out of the boat.

Otherwise, if you can put it together and pull it off, give me a time and place and I'm there. =D
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Offline Wade  
#21 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 12:40:05 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Formo Go to Quoted Post
I'm afraid there wouldn't be much fish being caught. And there wouldn't be any guarantee that I throw some of you guys out of the boat.

Otherwise, if you can put it together and pull it off, give me a time and place and I'm there. =D


Ditto on that. Would love to go "fishing" with you guys. Like Tex, I haven't been fishing since I lived in Wisconsin, but I definitely miss sitting on a pontoon boat drinking beer, shooting the shit, and waiting for a tasty bluegill or 20 to move the bobber.

Screwy Iowa....we have virtually no lakes. I miss the taste of panfish.

And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Offline Wade  
#22 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 1:31:39 PM(UTC)
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Hey, people will tell you I rant and whine about bureaucrats and other rule-makers and interfering busybodies at all levels of "guvmint".

As part of what you call my "propaganda/indoctrination" teaching, I occasionally mention the fact that the Federal Register (where fed regulations are all published for those of you don't know the name) adds over 100 thousand pages of rules every year. And probably 75,000 of those pages get "promulgated" and published in the Code of Federal Regulations.

That works out to about 300 books worth of legalese per year. Okay, everyone who has the time to read 300 books every year, or a staff to read them for you and give you "executive summaries", please raise your hand.

(I'd been wanting to bring a copy of the CFR to class for years when I saw John Stoessel do it on one of his YouTube videos. Alas, I've never had that kind of funds available.)

Call me paranoid. Call me loony. But I fail to see what makes a Department of Homeland Security any more trustworthy with respect to its actions than any of those other unelected bureaucrats are with regard to theirs. And I fail to see how Congresscritters who have enabled ("delegated") all that rule-making by the unelected with respect to people's daily lives and business are somehow more trustworthy when it comes to doing so with respect to terrorism.

Nor do I trust state government.

Local government -- I trust them a bit more because I live in a town of 1200 and so they're typically neighbors who have to deal with my bitching in person if they get too far out of line.

But I don't bitch about state and local government as much as I bitch about the federals (and in particular TSA and Homeland Security), because unlike state and locals, they don't interfere in any significant way with my ability to travel or trade.

Thanks to Justice Jackson and the Wickard v. Filburn court, there's not a damn part of economic life that is immune from federal government interference, legislative AND bureaucratic, via the Commerce and Supremacy clauses and the delegation doctrine.

You'll dismiss this as trivial, but in my "pursuit of happiness" as a collector of obselete and/or casino chips, I buy a lot of stuff on ebay, some from international sellers. Every time I do so, I have to walk over to the post office and sign for the package. And every time that I sign, my signature and my dealings, go into who knows how many government databases.

This makes us safer how?

Another bit. Do you know how many containers come into a port like Long Beach or Seattle every day? Do you really think Homeland Security, ATF, Border Control, and the dozen other agencies/departments regulating such imports can inspect anything more than a tiny fraction of what comes in by ship? Do you really think the terrorist bad guys are too stupid to know this? Do you really think that making every air traveler go through a security checkpoint is going to significantly impact terrorist plans to do terrorist stuff, when who knows what might be aboard the tens (hundreds?) of millions of semi-size containers that come into the country every year. Hell, there are between 8000 and 10000 separate truck loads hitting American highways and railways every day from Long Beach alone.

IMO, The damage that terrorists could do to us via another 9/11 or another Boston is TRIVIAL compared to what they could do us by taking out a container port. If you think a terrorist could hide and deliver a significant amount of NBCs hidden in his shoes and carryon bag in a commuter jet, just think of what he might hide and deliver via those ports and semi-trailers.

You want to be afraid of what terrorists can do, be afraid of THAT. Stop yammering about the trivial increase in safety that has come from interfering with my air travel and my chip collecting.



















And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Romans 12:2 (NKJV)
Online texaspackerbacker  
#23 Posted : Tuesday, June 18, 2013 3:16:13 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Wade Go to Quoted Post


Call me paranoid. Call me loony. But I fail to see what makes a Department of Homeland Security any more trustworthy with respect to its actions than any of those other unelected bureaucrats are with regard to theirs. And I fail to see how Congresscritters who have enabled ("delegated") all that rule-making by the unelected with respect to people's daily lives and business are somehow more trustworthy when it comes to doing so with respect to terrorism.

Another bit. Do you know how many containers come into a port like Long Beach or Seattle every day? Do you really think Homeland Security, ATF, Border Control, and the dozen other agencies/departments regulating such imports can inspect anything more than a tiny fraction of what comes in by ship? Do you really think the terrorist bad guys are too stupid to know this? Do you really think that making every air traveler go through a security checkpoint is going to significantly impact terrorist plans to do terrorist stuff, when who knows what might be aboard the tens (hundreds?) of millions of semi-size containers that come into the country every year. Hell, there are between 8000 and 10000 separate truck loads hitting American highways and railways every day from Long Beach alone.

IMO, The damage that terrorists could do to us via another 9/11 or another Boston is TRIVIAL compared to what they could do us by taking out a container port. If you think a terrorist could hide and deliver a significant amount of NBCs hidden in his shoes and carryon bag in a commuter jet, just think of what he might hide and deliver via those ports and semi-trailers.

You want to be afraid of what terrorists can do, be afraid of THAT. Stop yammering about the trivial increase in safety that has come from interfering with my air travel and my chip collecting.



As seems to happen so often with you, Wade, you miss the point. It's not about Department of Homeland Security necessarily being trustworthy. It is TWO factors: 1. as I/we have said a lot of times already, the stakes are higher in the realm DHS deals with than with other agencies, and 2. the concept that really seems to fly right over the heads of you guys, there is little or no motivation. WHY would you paranoically conclude that Mr. X, Mr. Y, and Mr. Z, three random government workers, presumably just simple normal people like you and I, would get their jollies messing with the freedoms you/we cherish so much? Go a level higher to their bosses - same question. Go up another level and another, ditto. If they have any ulterior motive at all other than just going to work and doing whatever they do, the obvious presumption is that they consider themselves patriots - the thin line of defense standing between the horrendously evil terrorist enemy and the American citizenry. WHY would you be so paranoid as to assume other motives to them?

Inconvenience: I too fly occasionally - probably not as much as you, but I ask you, seriously, are the anti-terrorist measures REALLY that bad - moderate lines, taking your shoes off, etc. - that it is worse than the prospect of a significant terrorist act? And going to the post office and SIGNING for a package? Sheesh! That isn't even a terrorist thing. That is about making sure that YOU got what you ordered - not somebody else by mistake or theft.

And your thing about the ports, thank you very much, you illustrate my point very well. Hell yeah, they CAN'T inspect every container. Yet no hidden nuke or dirty bomb or chem- or bio- thing has been delviered that way. What does that tell you? What it SHOULD tell you is there is a helluva lot going on behind the scenes that we never hear about, but it is highly effective at combating the bad guys - which brings us right back to square one, the Patriot Act, government surveillance, whatever other measures the good guys do to foil the bad guys - the exact stuff you guys love to complain about. I'm damn thankful for all of that - you're not?

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If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
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