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Offline DoddPower  
#226 Posted : Saturday, July 12, 2014 4:10:16 PM(UTC)
DoddPower

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
You might be right about the D but how many high picks do you want to shuttle to Dom's careful hands? The defense has had issues for years and several attempts to fix it have failed. That is TT, that is Dom and now it's Mike McCarthy also.

Have you recently seen the team head into the season with such a terrible group of TE's?

We're all about to see just how much the lack of a TE means to the Packers. The year we won the SB we had a good D. I would say we don't have one now. Let's see if the pairing of no good TE and no good D works out for us. Many here think Quarless and his ring justify him and prove beyond a shadow of a doubt we can win it all without a good TE this year. We shall see.



There's no definitive proof of anything. There is no single path of becoming a championship football team. Every team is going to have weaknesses, especially one paying an elite quarterback and a few other top of league players. If a tight end group of Quarless, Rodgers, Taylor, Lyerla, Bostick, Stoneburner, et al. is the Packers biggest weakness, most people would be more than OK with that. Recent history has proven that the Packers can still be very deadly with a below average tight end group. Of course it would be better if the Packers had a more "proven" option, but that doesn't mean they can't win without one. It's also not unreasonable to think one of the players currently on the roster might actually be pretty good. The factors that will limit the Packers chance at becoming champions again are:

1.) Injuries
2.) Defense (basically every position except cornerback, maybe)
3.) Offensive Line
4.) Coaching
5.) Tight ends

One could probably even find other items to put in front of number 5. The gap between #5 and 1-4 is substantial. The Packers could still easily lose with Jimmy Graham and a horrible defense. Last year's Super Bowl is a pretty good example of that. Personally, I would rather the team go in with a mediocre tight end group with some potential and a very good defense, than an elite tight end and a horrible defense. It's unrealistic to expect a team to have it all, despite how much we would all love that. It's not the way the league is designed to function.
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uffda udfa on 7/12/2014(UTC)
Offline uffda udfa  
#227 Posted : Saturday, July 12, 2014 5:00:54 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Originally Posted by: DoddPower Go to Quoted Post
There's no definitive proof of anything. There is no single path of becoming a championship football team. Every team is going to have weaknesses, especially one paying an elite quarterback and a few other top of league players. If a tight end group of Quarless, Rodgers, Taylor, Lyerla, Bostick, Stoneburner, et al. is the Packers biggest weakness, most people would be more than OK with that. Recent history has proven that the Packers can still be very deadly with a below average tight end group. Of course it would be better if the Packers had a more "proven" option, but that doesn't mean they can't win without one. It's also not unreasonable to think one of the players currently on the roster might actually be pretty good. The factors that will limit the Packers chance at becoming champions again are:

1.) Injuries
2.) Defense (basically every position except cornerback, maybe)
3.) Offensive Line
4.) Coaching
5.) Tight ends

One could probably even find other items to put in front of number 5. The gap between #5 and 1-4 is substantial. The Packers could still easily lose with Jimmy Graham and a horrible defense. Last year's Super Bowl is a pretty good example of that. Personally, I would rather the team go in with a mediocre tight end group with some potential and a very good defense, than an elite tight end and a horrible defense. It's unrealistic to expect a team to have it all, despite how much we would all love that. It's not the way the league is designed to function.


Right, there may be no proof... but there rarely ever is in anything. However, when I type something that I strongly believe (no real proof) I'm a F'ing blankety blank but when you or others do it (no real proof) you're right and all of a sudden there is a board that has a mind that is anti what I'm all about even though neither side has no real proof. It's fine that you find strength in numbers. I know you do. That is why I played the Schefter, Werder, Davis, Florio card. You think that this is all of you against me and me only. It wasn't. I was hardly alone, maybe here, but not among people who are very rigorous followers of the NFL. That was meant to remove your collective superiority complex against my way of thinking by citing the numbers on this board were in your favor. I even was told that someone here asked about 20 of his Packers friends about this. BTW, if it was truly insane, that question would never have been posed to 20 of his Packers fan buddies. That poster got some confidence that I was wrong by asking 20 of his friends who follow the Packers if that made sense. Of course, I know none of these people and all of them might not be able to spell cat if spotted the c and the t but that is validation I'm wrong. However, 4 respected members of the NFL media are just nobodies and I get mocked for stating that to buoy my point. Again, if you don't see the richness of the irony.

I would add SAFETY to the top of your list...ILB is up there, too. DL might be up there also. TE is the only one you mentioned that is a skill position that plays with Aaron Rodgers. We may have the weakest overall receiving unit in the NFCN when the TE is factored in. Again, Packer fan thinks that Green Bay is superior in this position group because that's how it was when we had Jennings, Jordy, Driver, Cobb, Jones and Finley. We aren't the same anymore. We've changed...not a little....a lot. I'm not so sure WR is such a great strength. I love Cobb and I really like Jordy... the rest I'm not so sure about. I have high hopes for Abby and Janis and am worried about Adams.

One big point is... it is silly to say Quarless is good because we won the SB with him at TE. It is also silly to say we don't need a good TE to win the SB, if the defense in 2014 isn't anywhere near as good as it was in 2010. We may need the TE position to be a great strength with our weak D this year. Having a weak TE and a weak D won't be a good combo.

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Offline DoddPower  
#228 Posted : Saturday, July 12, 2014 5:23:44 PM(UTC)
DoddPower

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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
Right, there may be no proof... but there rarely ever is in anything. However, when I type something that I strongly believe (no real proof) I'm a F'ing blankety blank but when you or others do it (no real proof) you're right and all of a sudden there is a board that has a mind that is anti what I'm all about even though neither side has no real proof. It's fine that you find strength in numbers. I know you do. That is why I played the Schefter, Werder, Davis, Florio card. You think that this is all of you against me and me only. It wasn't. I was hardly alone, maybe here, but not among people who are very rigorous followers of the NFL. That was meant to remove your collective superiority complex against my way of thinking by citing the numbers on this board were in your favor. I even was told that someone here asked about 20 of his Packers friends about this. BTW, if it was truly insane, that question would never have been posed to 20 of his Packers fan buddies. That poster got some confidence that I was wrong by asking 20 of his friends who follow the Packers if that made sense. Of course, I know none of these people and all of them might not be able to spell cat if spotted the c and the t but that is validation I'm wrong. However, 4 respected members of the NFL media are just nobodies and I get mocked for stating that to buoy my point. Again, if you don't see the richness of the irony.


What? These are the type of responses that don't even merit responses. I'll just let you have your space there.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
I would add SAFETY to the top of your list...ILB is up there, too. DL might be up there also. TE is the only one you mentioned that is a skill position that plays with Aaron Rodgers. We may have the weakest overall receiving unit in the NFCN when the TE is factored in. Again, Packer fan thinks that Green Bay is superior in this position group because that's how it was when we had Jennings, Jordy, Driver, Cobb, Jones and Finley. We aren't the same anymore. We've changed...not a little....a lot. I'm not so sure WR is such a great strength. I love Cobb and I really like Jordy... the rest I'm not so sure about. I have high hopes for Abby and Janis and am worried about Adams.


That's exactly why I listed the entire defense, except for potentially cornerback. You are worried about the Packers offense, I am not. I think they will be fine. Eddie Lacy and James Starks have to be factored into the equation, as well. The Packers might not have the best offensive weapons on paper, but I think they will still have a top offense in terms of production, which is really all that matters in the end. It could be better. That will always be the case. But I have more faith in the young options developing nicely than you do and I see little reason to doubt Ted Thompson or the Green Bay Packers coaching staffs ability in that arena. They consistently develop talent there. Boykin has already proven he can be a solid #3 or 4 wide receiver. The combination of Adams, Abbrederis, Janis, and others makes me feel comfortable for the number 4 and 5 wide receiver spots.

Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
One big point is... it is silly to say Quarless is good because we won the SB with him at TE. It is also silly to say we don't need a good TE to win the SB, if the defense in 2014 isn't anywhere near as good as it was in 2010. We may need the TE position to be a great strength with our weak D this year. Having a weak TE and a weak D won't be a good combo.


I never said Quarless is good because the Packers won a Super Bowl. I said recent Packers history has proven it's possible to win with a mediocre tight end group. In other words, it's not absolutely essential to have an elite tight end. I do, however, think it is essential to have a very good defense, at minimum. Which is why I would prefer resources devoted to that side of the ball rather than a position that I don't believe is an absolute requirement. I don't care how many draft picks it takes, so long as it gets fixed soon. I don't expect to win a Super Bowl every season, or even very often no matter who is running the team. But a couple holes filled on defense and the Packers are as much of a contender as anyone else. That's not a bad position to be in. Life is pretty good as a Packers fan.

Offline uffda udfa  
#229 Posted : Saturday, July 12, 2014 7:30:33 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Originally Posted by: DoddPower Go to Quoted Post
What? These are the type of responses that don't even merit responses. I'll just let you have your space there.


It absolutely merits a response. It is at the heart of the supposed issues with me. I say stupid things...I'm the one with a superiority complex. According to who? You and a couple of other guys on a message board? Oh no! Not that! Anything but some guys on a message board banding together to tell me I'm dumb and feel superior? How hurtful that is. You absolutely have to be right because you've been on a message board for some time together! No way it is you who is "dumb" and have a "superiority complex". I will ask this question again and again and again with no answer. Do you feel you are right when you offer an opinion? You absolutely believe it or you wouldn't post it. Same with me. Why the charge that I feel superior because I think my opinion is right when you think yours is right also? HYPOCRISY. Ultimate hypocrisy. The difference is presentation. I am sold out for my opinion. A lot of you say one line and try to hide behind the idea that my opinion is crazy and "doesn't merit a response". You don't respond because you can't respond intelligently so the best thing to do is label and mock me and my opinion. It's great reading. I know, I know this doesn't merit a response. Classic.






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Offline sschind  
#230 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 7:46:30 AM(UTC)
sschind

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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
I'll continue riding with Schefter, Werder, Nate Davis and Mike Florio on this one. We're the "stupid" group for sure. Packers are "well stocked" and ready to roll at TE. Oh, and even if they aren't there is so much overwhelming talent on O, plus, don't forget we have Aaron who makes everything all better to cover all of our deficiencies. So, instead of accentuating Aaron's abilities we're going to just drain them and hope we don't drain them enough to compete with the Seattle and SF's of the world. We think that much of him that he's got enough.

No Jimmy Graham news... So, it is assumed Graham did not appeal his decision of being a TE at 7 million for the franchise tag, yesterday. Tuesday the 15th is almost here.


You looked for people who agreed with you and you ride with them but did you ever consider how many of these guy's peers think it is a bad idea? I've said it before but fans are not always the most objective people to be listening to. We have too much invested emotionally to think rationally at times (that goes both ways with this argument as well)

The problem is that this sort of topic is only going to come up from one of these guys if they think it is a good idea so if another thinks its a bad idea, unless he is responding directly, he is not going to come out and say "I think its a bad idea"

For example, lets just say someone thinks its a good idea if the Packers traded Rodgers for a bunch of players and picks to restock. He is going to write an article or post on a blog somewhere where he thinks this is a good idea. On the other hand, the guys who think this is a bad idea are not going to simply out of the blue fire off an article saying its a bad idea for the Packers to trade Rodgers.

Its the good idea people that start the whole thing and then a few bad idea people might respond but most will probably just ignore it unless specifically asked. They are too busy looking for their own headline grabbing good ideas to waste their time on such nonsense.

That is why it is not too difficult to find a few people who would agree with just about any idea.
I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
Offline sschind  
#231 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 8:13:34 AM(UTC)
sschind

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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
Yep...competitive. It took frigid temps that SF clearly wasn't used to to even the playing field for us.

So, we can almost beat SF, but then there's...SEATTLE who is better.

Graham helps us so much. Just a stud TE. We need studs to compete or are you going to trust Dom Capers is going to construct plans to stop SF and SEA? Now, that is funny or sad.


So the 49ers get to use the weather as an excuse but we simply suck is that it? Maybe we are closer than you think.

Its pretty much impossible to be the BEST team in the league every single year. The good thing is that there is no guarantee the the BEST team will win it all every year. That is why being close to the best every year may be more important than blowing it all for a chance to be the BEST for a year or two and sucking for several years in between.

You don't think we are close to the best so you make your arguments (trade for Graham, ditch Ted.) That is where most of us would disagree. We think we are closer to the best than you do. We don't see the need for such drastic measures. We look at the past as things that have happened before and have very little to no bearing on what will or might happen in the future. You look at the past and think since it has happened before it will most likely happen again. We look at changes Ted Thompson has made and we are optimistic you look at the changes Ted has made and automatically write them off as failures because Ted is the one who made them and some of his changes in the past have failed.

I honestly don't know if I could be a fan if I had your attitude. I would have to have some sort of positive outlook or what would be the point. If I had to face the season thinking "oh my God here we go again what a painful thing this is going to be to watch again this year" I don't think I would waste my time. My love for the team and the history might not be enough to carry me through.

I do understand that you are trying to be objective but in your attempt to not be a homer I think you may be going a little to far in the other direction.

I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
Offline sschind  
#232 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 8:19:47 AM(UTC)
sschind

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Originally Posted by: dhazer Go to Quoted Post
No proven option hmmmmmmm, If I recall we have a guy that played alot the past few years including a guy that we wona Super Bowl with, but I guess he is unproven as you say.


I don't get that argument at all. Just because we happened to win a SB with this guy as our starter doesn't mean we shouldn't be looking to replace him.

Every single team that wins the SB has a starter or two that they would replace if they could get a better guy.

I'm not saying trade for JG but to say we won a SB with this guy so he is good enough just doesn't make sense.
I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
Offline uffda udfa  
#233 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 12:36:21 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Originally Posted by: sschind Go to Quoted Post
So the 49ers get to use the weather as an excuse but we simply suck is that it? Maybe we are closer than you think.

Its pretty much impossible to be the BEST team in the league every single year. The good thing is that there is no guarantee the the BEST team will win it all every year. That is why being close to the best every year may be more important than blowing it all for a chance to be the BEST for a year or two and sucking for several years in between.

You don't think we are close to the best so you make your arguments (trade for Graham, ditch Ted.) That is where most of us would disagree. We think we are closer to the best than you do. We don't see the need for such drastic measures. We look at the past as things that have happened before and have very little to no bearing on what will or might happen in the future. You look at the past and think since it has happened before it will most likely happen again. We look at changes Ted Thompson has made and we are optimistic you look at the changes Ted has made and automatically write them off as failures because Ted is the one who made them and some of his changes in the past have failed.

I honestly don't know if I could be a fan if I had your attitude. I would have to have some sort of positive outlook or what would be the point. If I had to face the season thinking "oh my God here we go again what a painful thing this is going to be to watch again this year" I don't think I would waste my time. My love for the team and the history might not be enough to carry me through.

I do understand that you are trying to be objective but in your attempt to not be a homer I think you may be going a little to far in the other direction.



"History repeats itself."..."Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it."..."That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."... "There's nothing new under the sun." This may be one reason there's such a disconnect. The NFL is cyclical as life is.

I said earlier that my fandom is not as fun as it once was once I incorporated objectivity into it. Most of you want to remain objectivity free. There is no question me not drinking the kool aid/being a homer is going to conflict with those who are. It doesn't mean I'm not as big a fan as you, it means I see things very differently. Clearly, most of you don't celebrate diversity. I knew when I started here it would probably get to this point. Yes, close minded....and that's fine, I guess. Most of you love being part of the Packer way and are happy in that world of what Ted does must be right only until it isn't. I get it. I come across as a jerk a guy who is crazy superior etc...all labels you affix to me because I'm DIFFERENT not any of those things you say I am...it's just how you process and justify in your mind the things I say because they are so foreign to your way of thinking. The flat earth society sure didn't like anyone telling them the earth was round. Yes, that does go both ways. I don't claim that I'm always right...only that I believe the things I type and work hard to make my case. The shots taken at me don't bother me because I realize what they're coming out of.

You have no idea what is going on behind the scenes with me. I don't want to make all of you so uncomfortable and threatened. That bothers me. I would choose not to be here if I knew ALL of you were so affected and that it really was "hurting you" having your ideas about your favorite football team questioned and turned upside down.
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Offline uffda udfa  
#234 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 12:45:39 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Originally Posted by: sschind Go to Quoted Post
So the 49ers get to use the weather as an excuse but we simply suck is that it? Maybe we are closer than you think.

Its pretty much impossible to be the BEST team in the league every single year. The good thing is that there is no guarantee the the BEST team will win it all every year. That is why being close to the best every year may be more important than blowing it all for a chance to be the BEST for a year or two and sucking for several years in between.

You don't think we are close to the best so you make your arguments (trade for Graham, ditch Ted.) That is where most of us would disagree. We think we are closer to the best than you do. We don't see the need for such drastic measures. We look at the past as things that have happened before and have very little to no bearing on what will or might happen in the future. You look at the past and think since it has happened before it will most likely happen again. We look at changes Ted Thompson has made and we are optimistic you look at the changes Ted has made and automatically write them off as failures because Ted is the one who made them and some of his changes in the past have failed.

I honestly don't know if I could be a fan if I had your attitude. I would have to have some sort of positive outlook or what would be the point. If I had to face the season thinking "oh my God here we go again what a painful thing this is going to be to watch again this year" I don't think I would waste my time. My love for the team and the history might not be enough to carry me through.

I do understand that you are trying to be objective but in your attempt to not be a homer I think you may be going a little to far in the other direction.



Yes, the Niners get weather as an excuse. Would you rather play the Saints in their Dome or at Lambeau in January? Are the Saints anything outside of their dome? We were given a HUGE advantage with the weather. Don't tell me you weren't tickled the Niners were coming to play in the frigid temps and that you didn't think it was a huge psychological advantage. I sure did. I thought we might win due to it...not because we were better, but because it set up well for us... we still lost. Yes, all the injuries and Micah not pulling that one down...so close. Just not good enough. Settling for 3 instead of the TD killed us...red zone issues...all year. A lot to do with why I want Jimmy. Having him vs. not could've very well been the difference in that game. 7 instead of 3 and we have a much better shot at hanging on for the win. Close is really far
a lot of the time. Close ain't close enough. Most are content with close...the illusion is we're right there. Seattle is better. Being close to SF is no longer all that important now. There are bigger dragons to try and slay and we can't beat the penultimate one in the NFC.
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Offline uffda udfa  
#235 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 1:00:03 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Graham's camp believes the deadline for an appeal is Monday 4 ET and profootballtalk.com believes this will all be over by then one way or the other.

That is 24 hours from now, to the minute, on my laptop screen. One more day. Very curious to see what happens tomorrow.
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Offline sschind  
#236 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 1:20:22 PM(UTC)
sschind

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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
"History repeats itself."..."Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it."..."That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history."... "There's nothing new under the sun." This may be one reason there's such a disconnect. The NFL is cyclical as life is.

I said earlier that my fandom is not as fun as it once was once I incorporated objectivity into it. Most of you want to remain objectivity free. There is no question me not drinking the kool aid/being a homer is going to conflict with those who are. It doesn't mean I'm not as big a fan as you, it means I see things very differently. Clearly, most of you don't celebrate diversity. I knew when I started here it would probably get to this point. Yes, close minded....and that's fine, I guess. Most of you love being part of the Packer way and are happy in that world of what Ted does must be right only until it isn't. I get it. I come across as a jerk a guy who is crazy superior etc...all labels you affix to me because I'm DIFFERENT not any of those things you say I am...it's just how you process and justify in your mind the things I say because they are so foreign to your way of thinking. The flat earth society sure didn't like anyone telling them the earth was round. Yes, that does go both ways. I don't claim that I'm always right...only that I believe the things I type and work hard to make my case. The shots taken at me don't bother me because I realize what they're coming out of.

You have no idea what is going on behind the scenes with me. I don't want to make all of you so uncomfortable and threatened. That bothers me. I would choose not to be here if I knew ALL of you were so affected and that it really was "hurting you" having your ideas about your favorite football team questioned and turned upside down.


Cyclical does not mean that just because something happened in the past means it WILL happen again. Cyclical means that things that happen in the past have a tendency to happen again if no one pays any attention to it. There is a difference.

For the record I do not think I ever called you a jerk or said you were acting all superior so I hope you are using YOU in a generic sense. I do think your posts are a bit off the wall sometimes and quite frankly a bit ridiculous because I don't agree with you but that doesn't mean I think you are less of a fan. We all want what is best for the team we just don't agree what that is. As far as knowing what is going on behind the scenes with you you are right, I have no idea. None of us do and we wouldn't unless you decided to share that. In all likelihood however none of us really care. You say things we don't agree with and we post counter arguments. It is nothing more than that for most of us. Some may go over the top in their responses but we all do on occasion. I think you are giving yourself a little too much credit in saying you make us feel uncomfortable. As for people leaving this site because of you. or any other poster for that matter, that is just childish. If I left every site I was on because of one member that I didn't agree with or didn't like I probably wouldn't be on any sites and if I were those sites would probably be rather boring.

I for one don't mind the banter.

I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
Offline DarkaneRules  
#237 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 1:22:12 PM(UTC)
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I am also curious how it pans out. It will be quite a spectacle one way or another. He is one of the best players in the league at any position and entering the prime of his career. He should be desiring as much money as he can get.
Circular Arguments: They are a heck of an annoyance
Offline steveishere  
#238 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 1:23:11 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: sschind Go to Quoted Post
I don't get that argument at all. Just because we happened to win a SB with this guy as our starter doesn't mean we shouldn't be looking to replace him.

Every single team that wins the SB has a starter or two that they would replace if they could get a better guy.

I'm not saying trade for JG but to say we won a SB with this guy so he is good enough just doesn't make sense.


I agree that that's not a good argument or we should just bring back Zombo. I've never been much of a fan of Quarless either but he did finish the season pretty strong last year. I'm fine going into next year with him as the starter. If Bostic or one of the new guys is good enough to beat him out for the spot then I'll feel pretty good about whoever that is.
Offline uffda udfa  
#239 Posted : Sunday, July 13, 2014 1:46:40 PM(UTC)
uffda udfa

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Originally Posted by: sschind Go to Quoted Post
Cyclical does not mean that just because something happened in the past means it WILL happen again. Cyclical means that things that happen in the past have a tendency to happen again if no one pays any attention to it. There is a difference.

For the record I do not think I ever called you a jerk or said you were acting all superior so I hope you are using YOU in a generic sense. I do think your posts are a bit off the wall sometimes and quite frankly a bit ridiculous because I don't agree with you but that doesn't mean I think you are less of a fan. We all want what is best for the team we just don't agree what that is. As far as knowing what is going on behind the scenes with you you are right, I have no idea. None of us do and we wouldn't unless you decided to share that. In all likelihood however none of us really care. You say things we don't agree with and we post counter arguments. It is nothing more than that for most of us. Some may go over the top in their responses but we all do on occasion. I think you are giving yourself a little too much credit in saying you make us feel uncomfortable. As for people leaving this site because of you. or any other poster for that matter, that is just childish. If I left every site I was on because of one member that I didn't agree with or didn't like I probably wouldn't be on any sites and if I were those sites would probably be rather boring.

I for one don't mind the banter.



I don't think everyone is anything here at this board. IE: not everyone is a homer. I enjoy you as a fellow poster and quite a few others. Some I don't enjoy all that much but every single poster brings something to this forum. I don't think I threaten all of you or maybe even most of you but I certainly threaten some. That group happens to be quite vocal...the greater the perceived threat the stronger the lashing out.

As for what I'm going through, it's nothing major....I contacted Kevin a couple of days ago regarding some things that I'm sensitive to. I certainly don't want to be a driving force for someone to leave here, and I really shouldn't be as there's no reason for it. Should I stop busting on certain posters when they make crazy statements? No. In the same way, you won't stop busting on me when you think I've made crazy statements.

I couldn't stress enough this is entertainment. It should be taken as such... to allow me, or anyone, run someone off when that is not my aim is sad. If someone was gunning for trying to get people to quit here I think that person should be dealt with. That is not what I want. I want someone to explain to me why Davante Adams is better than Sterling or why Jarrett Boykin is as good as Alshon Jeffery. I care more about why you say something vs. the fact you just said it. We should be able to ask questions. Some make statements and expect them to go unchallenged. I certainly have had mine challenged and that's great fun. If it isn't fun for you to back up what you type here then I think you shouldn't be typing in the first place. That is how I see it. You may not.

I'm going to get all riled up when Graham isn't extended tomorrow. Anxious

EDIT: One thing that tires me out like my posts do to some is continually reading "No TE is worth two 1st round picks" Why? It is just accepted when someone writes something like that. I would say most agree with that sentiment...but...why? I've gone to great lengths to show it really isn't crazy at all but it just keeps coming back to... it isn't worth it and that's crazy. Why? I guess because you said so is what I'm to accept. I have yet to see anyone actually debunk the idea that our odds of getting a Jimmy Graham type with a 1st rounder as being less than 10%. Too bad...it's just dumb because someone says it's dumb without explanation. I don't know, if you really wanted to, how you couldn't see how that looks to me. I research and present facts, which ultimately get ridiculed which is funny to me, but the reply back is one line about how dumb that is. No research no logic no nothing other than...that's dumb. You're dumb. You think you're superior. et al. It is fun to engage with fellow fans...few here engage...many insult mock label etc. I wish there were more "steveishere", "sschind" type of posters for the things I enjoy on a forum. The homers want homers like them. I want objective well versed posters to read who make compelling cases for their beliefs...I know, I do none of that and am irrelevant a nobody a joke etc...but that is who I wish to read.

Message modified by user Sunday, July 13, 2014 2:03:27 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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It's one heckuva drug.
Offline sschind  
#240 Posted : Monday, July 14, 2014 9:02:02 AM(UTC)
sschind

Rank: 4th Round Draft Pick

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Joined: 3/5/2013(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: uffda udfa Go to Quoted Post
I don't think everyone is anything here at this board. IE: not everyone is a homer. I enjoy you as a fellow poster and quite a few others. Some I don't enjoy all that much but every single poster brings something to this forum. I don't think I threaten all of you or maybe even most of you but I certainly threaten some. That group happens to be quite vocal...the greater the perceived threat the stronger the lashing out.

As for what I'm going through, it's nothing major....I contacted Kevin a couple of days ago regarding some things that I'm sensitive to. I certainly don't want to be a driving force for someone to leave here, and I really shouldn't be as there's no reason for it. Should I stop busting on certain posters when they make crazy statements? No. In the same way, you won't stop busting on me when you think I've made crazy statements.

I couldn't stress enough this is entertainment. It should be taken as such... to allow me, or anyone, run someone off when that is not my aim is sad. If someone was gunning for trying to get people to quit here I think that person should be dealt with. That is not what I want. I want someone to explain to me why Davante Adams is better than Sterling or why Jarrett Boykin is as good as Alshon Jeffery. I care more about why you say something vs. the fact you just said it. We should be able to ask questions. Some make statements and expect them to go unchallenged. I certainly have had mine challenged and that's great fun. If it isn't fun for you to back up what you type here then I think you shouldn't be typing in the first place. That is how I see it. You may not.

I'm going to get all riled up when Graham isn't extended tomorrow. Anxious

EDIT: One thing that tires me out like my posts do to some is continually reading "No TE is worth two 1st round picks" Why? It is just accepted when someone writes something like that. I would say most agree with that sentiment...but...why? I've gone to great lengths to show it really isn't crazy at all but it just keeps coming back to... it isn't worth it and that's crazy. Why? I guess because you said so is what I'm to accept. I have yet to see anyone actually debunk the idea that our odds of getting a Jimmy Graham type with a 1st rounder as being less than 10%. Too bad...it's just dumb because someone says it's dumb without explanation. I don't know, if you really wanted to, how you couldn't see how that looks to me. I research and present facts, which ultimately get ridiculed which is funny to me, but the reply back is one line about how dumb that is. No research no logic no nothing other than...that's dumb. You're dumb. You think you're superior. et al. It is fun to engage with fellow fans...few here engage...many insult mock label etc. I wish there were more "steveishere", "sschind" type of posters for the things I enjoy on a forum. The homers want homers like them. I want objective well versed posters to read who make compelling cases for their beliefs...I know, I do none of that and am irrelevant a nobody a joke etc...but that is who I wish to read.


I do think that a lot of us have explained why we don't think the trade would be a good idea just like you have explained why you think it would be.

I don't want to speak for others but I'll try to sum it up in a nutshell (word of warning to guys like dexter, sometimes I have pretty big nuts and big nuts have big shells so you might want to quit reading now before you get bored)

1) No TE is worth 2 #1 draft picks- I wouldn't say never but generally I would agree with this statement especially when ...

2) not only would that TE cost 2 #1's but likely 10 million dollars or more per season and quite likely another star player (Cobb?) because we couldn't afford to keep him whom we would then need to replace. Or when said TE...

3) would likely not play as prominent a role in the Packers offense as he does in his current offense thus reducing his numbers to a somewhat less than incredible level which leads us to the fact that ...

4) Most of us agree that he would be a huge upgrade at TE but we do not agree that even a huge upgrade at TE would translate into as huge of an upgrade overall as to be worth the cost it would take to get him which brings us back to #1 being no TE is worth 2 #1 draft picks. Cyclical and all that.

Add to it the fact that some of us are more concerned with our defense than our offense and we feel that if such a big outlay of draft picks, salary and potential loss of star players is going to happen it should be to acquire someone for our defense. I use the term US in a generic sense meaning those of us against you, not in the sense that I necessarily agree with this line of thinking.

Now those are the facts as I think most of us see them. Or maybe those are our opinions as most of us see them but either way, this is why we don't think trading for Graham is worth it. Perhaps a few have another agenda or maybe they have an ax to grind with you but I think they are laid out fairly obviously and I think they have been laid out fairly obviously in several of our prior posts. I do think you laid out your facts, or your opinions, rather obviously as well. I think most of us know exactly why you want to trade for Graham we just don't agree, but for all of us I don't think any of us can say we don't know why the other guy objects. Its out there. It may not be the truth but it is out there.

I respect your right to have your opinion but that doesn't mean I agree with it or respect you for having it.
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