Join Our Green Bay Packers Interactive Community!

We have been providing fans with the best source of Packers information since 2006!
Your participation is greatly anticipated!
Login or Register.
3 Pages<123>
Options
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline steveishere  
#16 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:06:08 PM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
I'll say the same thing sschind said, except it AIN'T sarcasm. I don't have any sympathy for anybody makes who knows how many million $ playing a fun game KNOWING he is risking messing up his future life from brain injury. I also have little or no sympathy for the people writing the checks for those salaries (even less for the God damned lawyers and agents sticking their noses into the controversy).


Thing is your sympathy means exactly jack and shit one way or the other. It's not your money it's theirs and they'll do with it what they wish. Hence the rules changing. Fans are going to keep watching football and people who get seriously hurt are going to keep suing the people in charge so they are going to try and keep people from getting seriously hurt. Your personal feelings don't figure into the equation.
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#17 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:14:52 PM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post

As for the "small risk" you take the sum total of all NFL players and the sum total of all significant long term brain problems as a fraction of that, and hell yeah it is small. Furthermore, you take the sum total of all head first hits or even helmet to helmet hits, and the sum total of all even short term brain injuries - concussions as a fraction of that, and I'd venture to say that is a pretty small fraction also.


Really? So what are the numbers then? What are the sum totals of brain damage? You really have no clue what the numbers are. You are making a guess on numbers that have been wholly undocumented over the years. There is no list on how many people have been damaged and how damaged they are and how many people were uninjured. Nobody knows. You are "venturing to say" your opinion on something that experts who spend their life studying don't even know that much about.

Either way if the guys in charge of the NFL did what you wanted and didn't give a shit about people getting TBIs or dieing the game wouldn't exist for very much longer. So your genius ideas would kill the game and it wouldn't matter anyway. Don't understand how you cannot see that.
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#18 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:25:08 PM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2014

United States
Joined: 3/4/2013(UTC)
Location: Texas

Applause Given: 450
Applause Received: 271

Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
Thing is your sympathy means exactly jack and sh!t one way or the other. It's not your money it's theirs and they'll do with it what they wish. Hence the rules changing. Fans are going to keep watching football and people who get seriously hurt are going to keep suing the people in charge so they are going to try and keep people from getting seriously hurt. Your personal feelings don't figure into the equation.


You are exactly right about that. Therefore, I will go on to say, hahahahaha, that the REAL evil here is the media people - stirring up similar feelings as valuable as jack shit in favor of all this silly shit. The damn media is on the same level of rottenness as the God damned blood-sucking lawyers who enable the damn lawsuits, etc. you are talking about.

Just expressing some jack shit feelings hahahaha.

Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#19 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:42:07 PM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2014

United States
Joined: 3/4/2013(UTC)
Location: Texas

Applause Given: 450
Applause Received: 271

Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
Really? So what are the numbers then? What are the sum totals of brain damage? You really have no clue what the numbers are. You are making a guess on numbers that have been wholly undocumented over the years. There is no list on how many people have been damaged and how damaged they are and how many people were uninjured. Nobody knows. You are "venturing to say" your opinion on something that experts who spend their life studying don't even know that much about.

Either way if the guys in charge of the NFL did what you wanted and didn't give a sh!t about people getting TBIs or dieing the game wouldn't exist for very much longer. So your genius ideas would kill the game and it wouldn't matter anyway. Don't understand how you cannot see that.


Well, you could start, I suppose, with the participants in that damn lawsuit as a fraction of total NFL players in that time period.

You are, of course, correct about that opinion, which I guess, makes my jack shit opinion about as valuable as those self-proclaimed experts.

Kill the game? You mean like it did the first hundred years or so up to now? Dying? Has anybody EVER died in an NFL game? I seem to recall a Detroit Lion back 50 or so years ago, but he had a heart attack because of a genetic disorder about cholesterol susceptibility or something - not really part of this discussion. If you can cite ANYBODY whose premature death was directly linked to head shots or whatever, I'd like to hear it. I'm pretty sure there aren't very many in all those years.

The thing that could kill the game (although almost certainly won't because people with common sense will prevail) is this idiotic emphasis and lawsuits, etc. on this ridiculous topic.

And not one word of reply about the possibility of players quitting because the risk is too great. If the risk is too great for the reward, you get out of the stock market, you don't bet on the horse, whatever. The fact that they ain't quitting in droves says the risk ain't very great - and the wimpy do-gooders want to make the risk even less? I have to ask WHY?

Message modified by user Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:54:40 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline K_Buz  
#20 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:50:27 PM(UTC)
K_Buz

Rank: 6th Round Draft Pick

Joined: 8/17/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 2
Applause Received: 26

Originally Posted by: musccy Go to Quoted Post
As was stated above, I think the NFL took into account that he sort of suspended himself already.



I find that hard to believe. I'm no expert in NFL contracts, but I believe he will still collect a check when he out with his concussion, but if he were to be suspended, he would not.

Offline steveishere  
#21 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:05:22 PM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
Well, you could start, I suppose, with the participants in that damn lawsuit as a fraction of total NFL players in that time period.

You are, of course, correct about that opinion, which I guess, makes my jack sh!t opinion about as valuable as those self-proclaimed experts.

Kill the game? You mean like it did the first hundred years or so up to now? Dying? Has anybody EVER died in an NFL game? I seem to recall a Detroit Lion back 50 or so years ago, but he had a heart attack because of a genetic disorder about cholesterol susceptibility or something - not really part of this discussion. If you can cite ANYBODY whose premature death was directly linked to head shots or whatever, I'd like to hear it. I'm pretty sure there aren't very many in all those years.

The thing that could kill the game (although almost certainly won't because people with common sense will prevail) is this idiotic emphasis and lawsuits, etc. on this ridiculous topic.


Yeah your opinion on brains is no doubt as valid as any "self proclaimed" (not sure what makes an actual expert self-proclaimed but whatever you say) expert who has spent their life studying them...

I'm sure that information on TBIs were just as advanced 50-60 years ago as they are today. Like I said TBIs regarding football participation has until now been pretty much completely undocumented so there is probably not much information linking deaths directly to football but many football players have died prematurely and you are delusional if you think none of that ever related to them playing.

In reality though none of that even matters because the fact is getting a bunch of concussions damages your brain. If the NFL ignored all of these health/brain studies and lawsuits and just let players do whatever they wanted and keep playing with head injuries and never changed anything the NFL would be shut down until they changed things.

Whether you want them to let people go out there and fuck up their bodies doesn't matter because people whose opinions do matter to whether the league can exist or not don't want that happening. The NFL isn't just changing their rules because it makes them happy they are changing rules because they HAVE TO.

You can say you honestly think it the league did NOTHING to combat brain injuries everything would go on just like it has "the last hundred years"?
Offline PackFanWithTwins  
#22 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:11:15 PM(UTC)
PackFanWithTwins

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Joined: 9/26/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 13
Applause Received: 371

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post
The victim is a Packer in this case, so I'm all for as heavy a punishment as possible, but sometime, the shoe will be on the other foot - or even just somebody hitting whoever the hell it is.

Call me evil; Call me old-fashioned; Whatever, but I just can't get into this whole mentality of no helmet to helmet/put a skirt on the QBs/ don't hit a "defenseless" receiver/ all that silly crap.

These guys get paid multiple millions to play a fun game that almost any of us would give almost anything to be good enough to play. Part of what they get paid so much for IMNHO, is the risk - and really it is a damn small risk even with helmet to helmet contact - of getting their brains scrambled. If they aren't up to that risk, let them quit the game and give up that HUGE money they get paid.


I am somewhat on the same page. There are hits to the head that happen, and there are hits to the head that are completely avoidable and should have everything possible to remove them from the game. And those are spearing. It has never been the proper way to tackle, and is not the way anybody should show our kids that play.

But as long as players are suing because they choose to play the game and have negative results from it, the league must act or lose.
The world needs ditch diggers to Danny!!!
UserPostedImage
Offline wpr  
#23 Posted : Wednesday, September 18, 2013 8:15:58 PM(UTC)
wpr

Rank: Hall of Famer

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Gold: 2012PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Gold: 2013FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Bronze: 2013

United States
Joined: 8/8/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 3,027
Applause Received: 1,467

Originally Posted by: texaspackerbacker Go to Quoted Post


Kill the game? You mean like it did the first hundred years or so up to now? Dying? Has anybody EVER died in an NFL game? I seem to recall a Detroit Lion back 50 or so years ago, but he had a heart attack because of a genetic disorder about cholesterol susceptibility or something - not really part of this discussion. If you can cite ANYBODY whose premature death was directly linked to head shots or whatever, I'd like to hear it. I'm pretty sure there aren't very many in all those years.


Jack Tatum's hit on Darryl Stingley paralyzed him. While it was not a concussion it was helmet to helmet hit. Darryl died at age 61.


Lionel Aldridge had mental issues. There is no way to say they weren't brought on by pounding his head against his opponent. He died at age 56.


There are hundreds of former players who we don't know if repeated hits to the head contributed to their health problems.

UserPostedImage

thanks Post received 1 applause.
yooperfan on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#24 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 8:38:54 AM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2014

United States
Joined: 3/4/2013(UTC)
Location: Texas

Applause Given: 450
Applause Received: 271

Good effort on the examples, but death came DECADES later, and you say yourself, there's no way to know if it was directly linked. There are a LOT of people who were never associated with football what have major bi-polar problems (or whatever it was with Aldridge) and die fairly young partly because their lifestyle.

You make my point more than countering it - two very questionable examples out of how many thousand who played in the NFL, many of which had serious hits to the head.

It's a long time since I saw the Stingly hit, BTW, and I will tell you with certainty, that kind of hit was common back then, and praised by virtually everybody - until the piece-of-crap whatevers (I am so tempted to use a political word - ooooh so terrible - here) and started getting all pious and disruptive of the status quo - the status quo almost always being a good thing (oooh is that political?)

The most significant - and IMNHO worst - effect on brains here is the WASHING of brains of the past couple of generations to be so hyper-concerned about this whole hits to the head thing.

And still nothing from the -anti crowd about risk v. reward - players NOT quitting because the danger is terrible to cause them to give up the HUGE money.
Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline steveishere  
#25 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:32:58 AM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

Im sure the nfl settled for 750 million even though there was no case to be made lol. Not only are you a brain damage expert you are also a better lawyer than what the nfl can afford. And all of this without even an ounce of research.
thanks Post received 2 applause.
wpr on 9/19/2013(UTC), DoddPower on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Offline steveishere  
#26 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:41:49 AM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

And ill just say that my personal opinion is that theygo too far with rule changes and penalties and such but it doesnt matter because they dont have a choice. If the nfl took the path you advocated and 100 percent ignored all safety issues they would be shut down.

Hits like the one pollard got fined for to me are fine because he wass playing football. The one by meriweather though isbs, he was just trying to hurt somebody. Im fine with keeping that shit out of the game
thanks Post received 3 applause.
nerdmann on 9/19/2013(UTC), wpr on 9/19/2013(UTC), DoddPower on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#27 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:48:36 AM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2014

United States
Joined: 3/4/2013(UTC)
Location: Texas

Applause Given: 450
Applause Received: 271

Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
Im sure the nfl settled for 750 million even though there was no case to be made lol. Not only are you a brain damage expert you are also a better lawyer than what the nfl can afford. And all of this without even an ounce of research.


I never made any particular claim to be an expert hahahaha, but if anything is a threat to the game, it is God damned lawyers. Vince and George Halas took care of one manifestation of that problem back in the day - getting Congress to go over the heads of those damned lawyers. I doubt that will happen here because too many regular people have been brain-washed to think this silliness is a real problem. Just the same, common sense will prevail and this will all blow over.

As for that $750 million settlement, did you read the fine print hahahahaha?

It is stretched out over a LONG period of time; It greatly inhibits future lawsuits; And the amount is not much more than a drop in the bucket of NFL income over the long haul. In short, you could say common sense already prevailed. The owners got off pretty easy - and well they should because this is just a bunch of do-gooder media trumped up bullshit anyway.

BTW, Steve, you still haven't said anything about why a lot of players don't just quit if this risk is really so real and serious. Or maybe their brains are already too scrambled to give up that HUGE money hahahaha.

Message modified by user Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:58:43 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline texaspackerbacker  
#28 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 9:55:23 AM(UTC)
texaspackerbacker

Rank: 1st Round Draft Pick

Yahoo! NCAA March Madness - Gold: 2014

United States
Joined: 3/4/2013(UTC)
Location: Texas

Applause Given: 450
Applause Received: 271

Originally Posted by: steveishere Go to Quoted Post
And ill just say that my personal opinion is that theygo too far with rule changes and penalties and such but it doesnt matter because they dont have a choice. If the nfl took the path you advocated and 100 percent ignored all safety issues they would be shut down.

Hits like the one pollard got fined for to me are fine because he wass playing football. The one by meriweather though isbs, he was just trying to hurt somebody. Im fine with keeping that sh!t out of the game


Did I say anything about ignoring anything?

I said they should have strong evidence of intent before suspending - fines are no big deal to those rich guys anyway.

Just because I said this is all bullshit doesn't mean the NFL should ignore it. There is a threat - NOT for real medical reasons, but for PR, PC, and God damned legal reasons. They can either appear to play along - which seems to be their strategy or they can have a counter-campaign to explain the statistics and why and how this is all bullshit - basically to unbrainwash the masses - which I guess they choose not to do. But ignore? You never ignore when the forces of ridiculousness are on the attack with media support.

Expressing the Good Normal Views of Good Normal Americans.
If Anything I Say Smacks of Extremism, Please Tell Me EXACTLY What.
Offline steveishere  
#29 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 10:13:47 AM(UTC)
steveishere

Rank: 2nd Round Draft Pick

FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Gold: 2013

Joined: 7/28/2012(UTC)

Applause Given: 47
Applause Received: 963

I would take the risk to play for millions but that doesnt mean I wouldnt also advocate them shutting down turds like meriweather out there trying to just knock me out
thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Offline wpr  
#30 Posted : Thursday, September 19, 2013 11:13:37 AM(UTC)
wpr

Rank: Hall of Famer

PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Gold: 2012PackersHome NFL Pick'em - Gold: 2013FleaFlicker Fantasy Football - Bronze: 2013

United States
Joined: 8/8/2008(UTC)

Applause Given: 3,027
Applause Received: 1,467

TX I am sorry someone didn't die right there on the playing field just to satisfy your morbid desires. haha. Dying at an early age is still dying. A man seriously wounded in battle who lingers for years with the affliction still dies from that injury even if a medic didn't toe tag him on the spot.

Like you I don't not know any of the fact for Aldridge's case. I am saying it is possible playing football (High school, college and NFL along with a bunch of sand lot games) contributed to his illness and his death. The same can be said for many of the other cases. You can not totally and completely state that head trauma did not effect them as much as you would like to believe it is so. Therefore you have to rail on the media brain washing people as your only defense.

UserPostedImage

thanks Post received 1 applause.
DoddPower on 9/19/2013(UTC)
Rss Feed 
Users browsing this topic
Guest (2)
3 Pages<123>
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Notification

Icon
Error

Tweeter

Recent Topics
50m / Green Bay Packers Talk / steveishere

1h / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

2h / Green Bay Packers Talk / wpr

3h / Green Bay Packers Talk / texaspackerbacker

4h / Green Bay Packers Talk / buckeyepackfan

9h / Announcements / Zero2Cool

19h / Green Bay Packers Talk / beast

21h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Zero2Cool

23h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Tezzy

23h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Tezzy

23h / Green Bay Packers Talk / Tezzy

21-Oct / Green Bay Packers Talk / Yerko

21-Oct / Green Bay Packers Talk / yooperfan

21-Oct / Green Bay Packers Talk / nerdmann

21-Oct / Green Bay Packers Talk / nerdmann