wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
2 years ago
Thanks Df. I'll grab some zeolite bags the next time I get to a town with a Home Depot.
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dfosterf
2 years ago

This has been an interesting read.
http://www.moneysmartsblog.com/why-you-cant-trust-real-estate-agents-when-buying-a-house/ 

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 


You have one thing going for you that in these worst case scenarios you can fall back on.

Us

Except me, of course, because I'm charging you.

Totally kidding. Anything starts bugging you, just let us know. The more you tell, the more I could help, as one of your "I have to consult my friends, first" friends.

Edit:

For shits and grins I called the listing agent on that property on Haven Rd. representing I was calling on my own behalf from VA with a possible interest in a move to GB. She told me it's an accepted contract, not gonna fall through, and ya, all the good ones are going in one to two days, and ya, she's heard about the crazy shit here.
That tells me if you want to buy now, you are in for some frustration based on your concerns and perceptions. You would have to move fast, and don't seem inclined to do so.
Zero2Cool
2 years ago

Edit:

For shits and grins I called the listing agent on that property on Haven Rd. representing I was calling on my own behalf from VA with a possible interest in a move to GB. She told me it's an accepted contract, not gonna fall through, and ya, all the good ones are going in one to two days, and ya, she's heard about the crazy shit here.
That tells me if you want to buy now, you are in for some frustration based on your concerns and perceptions. You would have to move fast, and don't seem inclined to do so.

Originally Posted by: dfosterf 



Thanks for calling! I'm perfectly fine moving fast. I am not fine being forced to move fast. If things all fall in line quickly, hell yeah, that is great! I just won't be told "hey someone came in with 2K more than your offer, you want to jump them?". Depending on where I'm at with my offer, I might say 1K over theirs and see where the dust settles. If the agent balks at that saying I need to go higher, I walk. If the agent comes back saying my offer was topped again, I walk.

I'm going to update the original post here with what my "needs" are.
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dfosterf
2 years ago
All this anecdotal stuff about what agents have done to screw people over is mostly a bunch of bullshit in the normal course of the business. No one has brought up the great check and balance to overpaying for a home. It has to appraise at the sales price or higher to keep the transaction together, or the buyer can walk. The listing agent knows this, the buyers agent knows this, and the owner knows this if the listing agent has even minimal expertise. That home goes off the market in the interim...At 95% loan to value, your buyer agent is not going to recommend that you overpay in order to get a signed contract, unless you have expressed a willingness to jack up your down-payment in the event it doesn't appraise, and in a rapidly appreciating market, this is what all parties sweat, as the appraisers use sold properties for comparable to subject properties. The level of mis information in this world amazes.You know who gets really pissed off when a house sells in like two days? The SELLER. " My agent is an idiot! I could have got x amount more! etc etc etc." This usually occurs after settlement, as he sweats the process too, but gets real forgetful about shit like the appraisal coming in right at the actual selling price..

Your problem in this market isn't greedy realtors, it's buyers that have a better down-payment ability. The house you saw that is under contract with a contingency is a great example. That listing agent didn't even ask me my level of interest in it, if I wanted to put in a back up offer...nothing. That speaks volumes, to me. I don't know this, but I bet I'm correct in assuming the contingency is the selling of a desirable house by the buyer, and this agent may have got that listing too, btw. And alot of cash cash going towards the house you were interested in, up to and including an all cash offer, and at or near full price. That is what happens in a sellers market...Nobody in that transaction would give a crap about an appraisal except possibly the buyer when they see the number if it came in lower than anticipated...if their bank even needs one, if there even is a bank involved. Equity is a wonderful thing. What you SHOULD be doing right now is shopping realtors, and next shopping banks, but instead you are shopping for houses, which frankly, is only good for educating you on your market, not getting a decent deal on a home you would actually want...in short, kinda wasting your time a bit.

Don't despair, though...in a sellers hot market, this time of year, sellers are putting their homes on the market at a rapid rate. The key is to get in the house quick, and this times sales are 90 days from nows comps...which means some quick appreciation for all who got in...see appraisal and sold mention for quick explanation on that.
Zero2Cool
2 years ago
Why would the seller care about the down payment? They get all their money regardless of what the buyer puts down.

This place here basically checks off everything I am needing and wanting.
https://www.coldwellbanker.com/property/2926-Zuider-Zee-Rd-Green-Bay-WI-54313/75841071/detail?src=list 
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Zero2Cool
2 years ago

I like the metal roof on the Tulip house. More than likely you will never need to replace it. This house is not in the flood zone. It ends about a block or two south of the house in the ACE hardware parking lot near their green houses. Most of the flood zone in south of Glendale Ave. I like the deck even if it needs a little care. You can grill brats before the game. Bathroom looks tiny but it is what it is. Check to see if the mortar in the chimney bricks has cracks or is coming loose. I like on demand water heaters. You don't have to pay to keep reheating the same water over and over again. We had one in my office but it only lasted a few years. I don't know why. Maybe my brother bought a crappy one.

Velp Ave
I like the table/counter against the wall. It makes use of limited space. It may not be but the kitchen looks bigger. Could be tricks of the camera. No a/c upstairs can be brutal but a window unit or two will work.
The flood zone is a long ways away. North of town in the woods off of Bridge rd. Also south of your place across the rd from the Chambers Hills storage units on County HS. I like the larger lot too.

Originally Posted by: wpr 



It's looking like this one is the only one that doesn't have Contingent labeled on it, lol.

https://www.coldwellbanker.com/property/2578-Tulip-Ln-Green-Bay-WI-54313/75816497/detail?src=list 
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wpr
  • wpr
  • Preferred Member
2 years ago

It's looking like this one is the only one that doesn't have Contingent labeled on it, lol.

https://www.coldwellbanker.com/property/2578-Tulip-Ln-Green-Bay-WI-54313/75816497/detail?src=list 

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 



It's not a bad house. Good roof. Updated kitchen. Basement looks like it's in good shape. I zoomed in on the chimney. They did some work on the brick but I can't see if there is some more that need to be tuck pointed.
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dfosterf
2 years ago

Why would the seller care about the down payment? They get all their money regardless of what the buyer puts down.

This place here basically checks off everything I am needing and wanting.
https://www.coldwellbanker.com/property/2926-Zuider-Zee-Rd-Green-Bay-WI-54313/75841071/detail?src=list 

Originally Posted by: Zero2Cool 


Because they want the sale to go through. If you put 5% down, the bank is going to send an appraiser that is making sure that the home is current value is 5% more than the loan. If it's 10% down, the bank is not as worried as it is at 5%. If you put 20% down, the bank is going to want another tight appraisal, because now the buyer is looking to avoid mortgage insurance. If you put about 25% or more down, they might only do a drive by appraisal, not even going in the house. If you put 50% or more down, they probably will not even order any appraisal. The seller is at risk of having his home off the market for several weeks in a hot market because appraisers are busy, and if the home doesn't come in at the selling price, the 5% buyer has the option to walk away from the agreement, because a selling contract includes language that allows him to do so if the loan doesn't go through on the terms specified. There are many sellers that will reject a 95% ltv buyer out of hand in certain hot markets. I don't know your market, and you may find out about it the hard way...its a possibility. This is another reason to get someone that knows your market. You could pick a bank that uses appraisers from outside your market, has no real expertise in determining where the market went from the comparable sold sales, and gives the home a low appraisal because of it. Large banks, for example, are notorious for this. A listing agent would advise his client that the buyers bank sucks, the appraisers suck, and I wouldn't recommend the risk of taking this guy's offer. Conversely, a buyer agent is going to advise you about banks that use local appraisers that know the market... That property on Zuderzee is also under contingent contract.I assume you are linking to show what you like. I like it too. So does everybody else, or at least one buyer. I assume you know you are paying for the appraisal, probably 250 to 300 bucks. Just imagine you are a seller that is using the proceeds of the sale to buy another home....that happens about 80% of the time. He sees the rapid acceleration in prices you see, and he sees interest rates lower than what he was paying. He has to move, has to plan for it...he decides to make an offer on another home contingent on the sale of his home. This is great, except one problem...in order to get the seller of the home to accept the contingency, the buyer has to convince the seller that your sale is solid...that's right, your seller is going to be presenting your offer that he has received, including Financials to HIS seller. THAT'S why he cares about where and how the money comes to him at settlement.....
Zero2Cool
2 years ago

Because they want the sale to go through. If you put 5% down, the bank is going to send an appraiser that is making sure that the home is current value is 5% more than the loan. If it's 10% down, the bank is not as worried as it is at 5%. If you put 20% down, the bank is going to want another tight appraisal, because now the buyer is looking to avoid mortgage insurance. If you put about 25% or more down, they might only do a drive by appraisal, not even going in the house. If you put 50% or more down, they probably will not even order any appraisal. The seller is at risk of having his home off the market for several weeks in a hot market because appraisers are busy, and if the home doesn't come in at the selling price, the 5% buyer has the option to walk away from the agreement, because a selling contract includes language that allows him to do so if the loan doesn't go through on the terms specified. There are many sellers that will reject a 95% ltv buyer out of hand in certain hot markets. I don't know your market, and you may find out about it the hard way...its a possibility. This is another reason to get someone that knows your market. You could pick a bank that uses appraisers from outside your market, has no real expertise in determining where the market went from the comparable sold sales, and gives the home a low appraisal because of it. Large banks, for example, are notorious for this. A listing agent would advise his client that the buyers bank sucks, the appraisers suck, and I wouldn't recommend the risk of taking this guy's offer. Conversely, a buyer agent is going to advise you about banks that use local appraisers that know the market... That property on Zuderzee is also under contingent contract.I assume you are linking to show what you like. I like it too. So does everybody else, or at least one buyer. I assume you know you are paying for the appraisal, probably 250 to 300 bucks. Just imagine you are a seller that is using the proceeds of the sale to buy another home....that happens about 80% of the time. He sees the rapid acceleration in prices you see, and he sees interest rates lower than what he was paying. He has to move, has to plan for it...he decides to make an offer on another home contingent on the sale of his home. This is great, except one problem...in order to get the seller of the home to accept the contingency, the buyer has to convince the seller that your sale is solid...that's right, your seller is going to be presenting your offer that he has received, including Financials to HIS seller. THAT'S why he cares about where and how the money comes to him at settlement.....

Originally Posted by: dfosterf 



So, since my comfortable range is under $200,000 I should just skip this process, forget getting an agent and keep renting? The house my ex girlfriend has was $180,000 and closing costs and everything was under $8,000 out of her pocket. That was end of 2017. I'm looking in same area and same price range. I was figuring I'd be looking at spending the same out of pocket as well, or double.
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dfosterf
2 years ago
You can stick to your 5% down plan, heck you can go to 3% down under fha, but you asked why sellers care about down payments because they get the same money at the end of the process and I told you why. As far as closing costs, I cannot advise you exactly on that because I don't know who pays the transfer tax in Wisconsin...I think the seller does there but here and many states it is split. I would imagine your out of pocket expenses would be similar to your ex gf, slightly less percentage wise 190 vs 180 due to the fixed nature of a couple of the costs. As far as what you do...Yes, if you think you cannot proceed by going to get an agent and getting a bank approval, I personally recommend you just rent. This is the biggest investment you will make in your lifetime, and without representation you are a babe in the woods, so to speak. You would not even know you were being screwed over while it was happening in so many scenarios. The first thing an agent would do is give you a breakdown of closing costs based on your comfort zone, it would have already occurred if you listened to me, but instead, you ask questions and ignore the advice if you don't like what you are hearing. So rent. It's a mistake, but rent.


Example: You wing it on your own. The inspector discovers that the heat pump is on its way out and recommends replacement. You tell the sellers agent, and they agree to take 8k from the proceeds and give it back to you at settlement, because you can have it repaired, they got an estimate and show it to you. You walk away from closing having only paid maybe a thousand instead of the 9k planned. Good deal? Maybe, probably not. You call the HVAC Co. and they tell you that while they CAN fix it, they recommended replacement with a more efficient model, along with the air handler, and that will be 12,599. Fix it or replace? Had you had an agent, he would have warned you about this and negotiated a better deal in my scenario, as ugly as it is.

My point is.. shit happens. It might not happen to you, and everything would go as planned, you stand in wonder as to why people pay the 4,5,6 percent to re agents when they sell. You continue to think that the pay is for finding you the right house. It is not. Realtors start to earn their pay, both listing agents and buyers agents, once the home is found and the process of contract to walking away from settlement with a happy buyer and seller begins. It starts with an honest acknowledgement that you don't know what you don't know. A good buyer agent is going to explain things to you as you go, why they are making the recommendation they are making, and importantly, ease your natural stress by handling unforseen circumstances if they arise. In the industry, they call it holding your hand.
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